Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby MPx » January 3rd, 2017, 4:16 pm

Couple of great sessions there Rod. 30@20 and 8x500R3:30 - Very racey. I'll be doing a similar 8x500 R3:30 next Tuesday (similar in distance/rest, not time!) so will be interesting to see how far off I am still. Last time I did it in Nov I managed an avg 1:48.7. Wish Carol well with the back issue. Cant help thinking it would be worth sorting that before attempting any more racing!

Dean, I also use RowPro - in my case an old version 3.016. Do you have the latest incarnation? Version 5 I think? I'm thinking of upgrading because my version is flakey and it keeps not writing all of the intervals I do, so I then have to delete the detailed info and import from the logcard as a continuous row - thereby losing most of the stats. Nice when it works tho!

I did a 10x1min R1 today. Last time on 15/11 I set off at 1:49.9 and managed 1:47.5 overall. Thought I'd try setting off at 1:44.9 this time and see what happened. What happened was that every single rep was a real grind which was a shame as I generally like this short stuff. Just one of those nights I guess. Still managed to stick with it.

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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby bisqeet » January 3rd, 2017, 4:48 pm

I was using a preview version 5.x
Mainly because I was testing some garmin hardware. That required a firmware upgrade. But then the stable version 4.3, couldn't be used online.
The preview was OK, but setting up custom rows was a little screwy, so I ended up using 4.3...
Rowpro have now released a stable 5.x version, it's downloaded, but not installed yet. I plan to update this week.
My current licence covers me for both versions, so that's nice...
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby MPx » January 3rd, 2017, 6:56 pm

Thanks Dean.... I'll maybe ask again next month and see what you think of the new one. Mike
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby bisqeet » January 4th, 2017, 4:38 am

MPx wrote:Thanks Dean.... I'll maybe ask again next month and see what you think of the new one. Mike

Hi Rogan,
I used
target hr = (max hr - rest hr) * trget % + rest hr

TR = (170-52) * 90% +52
= 118 * 90 % + 52
= 106,2 +52
90% = 158,2 (MHR)

I mistakingly misread the open
Max should have been 92,5 %
Or 161,2

D
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby bisqeet » January 4th, 2017, 1:45 pm

forget that - mispost.
installed 5.07 - looks the same as the 5.x preview.

the log reports now show decimal places - so thats a plus.
managed to create a few custom rows - seem to work ok. I liked the older interface better - maybe the newer one offers more customization.
online rows work.
automatical upload of rows to logbook. multiple users.

at the moment - I don't see why I would go back to 4.3, but will use it to test some more first. only did abouzt 5k today - more testing than anything (my rest day)
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby Rod » January 4th, 2017, 3:51 pm

What's worse than doing a 2k? Answer...doing 3 of them! (with only 2 minute rests, I'd prefer 2 weeks!)

1) 7:28.8....1:52.2.......34spm
2) 7:28.8....1:52.2.......34spm
3) 7:26.0....1:51.5.......34spm

Average pace 1:51.9.....34spm

This is 0.7 faster than when I last did it 2 weeks ago so chipping away nicely.

Happy to have got all 3 under 7:30....surely I can do ONE of the flippin' things under 7:00 soon?
Last edited by Rod on January 4th, 2017, 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
60 year old Lightweight male. Based in Sussex, just south of London, England. Best 2k recently.. 6:59.2 on 15th February 2017
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby bisqeet » January 4th, 2017, 4:37 pm

How much rest between, Rod?
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby Rod » January 4th, 2017, 5:18 pm

bisqeet wrote:How much rest between, Rod?


Oops....I should have said.....2 minutes. All static starts.

I've edited to post to include that now....thank you for prompting me Dean.
60 year old Lightweight male. Based in Sussex, just south of London, England. Best 2k recently.. 6:59.2 on 15th February 2017
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby bisqeet » January 4th, 2017, 5:55 pm

I would say you're aerobically for enough for a sub 7. Just the mental stuff you need to get your head around. :)
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby Rod » January 4th, 2017, 6:18 pm

bisqeet wrote:I would say you're aerobically for enough for a sub 7. Just the mental stuff you need to get your head around. :)


What is the ''Mental stuff'' Dean?
60 year old Lightweight male. Based in Sussex, just south of London, England. Best 2k recently.. 6:59.2 on 15th February 2017
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby bisqeet » January 4th, 2017, 11:46 pm

Rod wrote:
bisqeet wrote:I would say you're aerobically for enough for a sub 7. Just the mental stuff you need to get your head around. :)


What is the ''Mental stuff'' Dean?



for me - its actually getting on the rower and doing one. Don't know why, but the thought of doing a 2k TT just daunts me everytime.

I guess its making a race plan and sticking to it. splitting it down into phases works for me.

000-200m start and settle, sprint start +10
200-500m - test the waters target pace -1
500-1000m - hold the target pace
1000-1400 - breather time; targetpace max +1, keep if possible, puke later
1400-1700 - pain barrier
1700-1900 - wind it up
1900-2000 - empty the tanks
Dean
2017 Season: 196cm / 94kg : M48
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby Rod » January 5th, 2017, 3:08 am

bisqeet wrote:for me - its actually getting on the rower and doing one. Don't know why, but the thought of doing a 2k TT just daunts me everytime.

000-200m start and settle, sprint start +10
200-500m - test the waters target pace -1
500-1000m - hold the target pace
1000-1400 - breather time; targetpace max +1, keep if possible, puke later
1400-1700 - pain barrier
1700-1900 - wind it up
1900-2000 - empty the tanks


I guess we're all different, I've never been that worried about doing a 2k and tend to think some training sessions can be harder.

Sounds to me like you are starting too fast so no wonder it's so painful for you!

I know OTW rowers like to go out fast in a boat but on an erg that will use up energy that is badly needed later. I make my first 500 my slowest (about half to one second slower than target pace), the next 2 a little faster then the last one the fastest going flat out in the last 200.

If you put ''Caviston'' into the searchbox on the club fb page it will bring up a post I put on there about 2k pacing and an article by a top American coach called Mike Caviston who gives very good reasons not to go off too fast.
60 year old Lightweight male. Based in Sussex, just south of London, England. Best 2k recently.. 6:59.2 on 15th February 2017
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby bisqeet » January 5th, 2017, 10:34 am

i'm a bit of an underperformer - I always seem to have too much left at the end (although i feel shitty during).
my HR didnt even go over 160 on a 2k :/


anyway - todays offering:
yee old Eddy Fletcher HRMax test.
preordained 4' intervals with 30s rest based on 2k TT.
175W, 200W, 225W, 250W, Flatout.

Image

HR hit 172, which although I feel I could have got some more out of it with another 30s or so, will be my new HRMax for calculations..

then a 10k strappless, UT2 R17 - If I was going to get into gym kit, might as well do something...

Image


note:
i setup the interval row with an active spot (by accident),
it looks like the timer doesn't start unless you pull the cord. I was having to power through the finish and then take one more pull straight after other wise it wouldnt continue with the next interval.
might be an anti rolling start thing introduced by rowpro?
Dean
2017 Season: 196cm / 94kg : M48
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby MPx » January 5th, 2017, 7:49 pm

Blimey this is as much a head game as physical isn't it? Last two days have been "failures".

Wednesday did 30 min after weights. Decided to do it at 20 and started at 2:04. Blew 10 mins in and got slower and slower finishing with 7007m at 2:08.4 avg. Not sure what the problem was beyond not being able to make myself try any harder.

Then tonight was supposed to be a 6k TT. I was pleased to do 5k at 1:58.8 just before Christmas so thought I'd set off at 1:59 and see if I could hold on for another k. Turned out I could only hold on for 1k !!! I'm sure mental more than physical. Slowed to 2:05 then slowly pulled it back to about 2:02. Finished in 24:24. Not really in trouble with it just had nothing in the legs and no fight to make it happen. I'm thinking I may need a couple of days off! Trouble is its the dreaded blood letting session next Thursday and that will put paid to any improvements for another couple of weeks. B****r!

BTW on the 2k mindgames I've never been particularly daunted. Do one about every 6 weeks so its no big deal. I do 5 hard strokes then settle to target -1 to 500. Try to stick to target through 1500 but often go to target + on the third quarter. If I'm still in with a shout at three quarter distance confidence increases and I usually make it. If I'm really struggling by about 1200 or so then confidence folds and it can slow to a paddle in....
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Re: Sub 7 Indoor Rowing Club (UK)

Postby Two Pudding Kid » January 6th, 2017, 3:01 am

Dean - thanks for mentioning the Fletcher Max HR test, (I remember doing this when I used to have a cardboard Concept2 logbook - so that is some years ago). :shock: For me it is 50W, (I will have fun keeping to 3:11 pace), 75W, 100W, 125W and fly it like a 4 min TT. Put it on my list of things to do in March, (unless it sneaks onto the timetable instead of a run when i chicken out due to bad weather). :lol: Excellent UT2 R17 strapless 10k. PS If you have butterflies about rowing 2k try 2001m instead, (and just think how I feel when I put 42195m on the clock and commit to 200 minutes of craziness). :wink:

Rod - brilliant 8 x 500m r3:30 and 3 x 2k r2. You are certainly putting the training in for a Sub7 2k in a months time, (I will hopefully be there to witness it if I am not busy getting ready for my race at the time). :o Sorry to hear of Carols back problems, (from experience of an L5/SI disk bulge in 2010 I could only potter along for a few months afterwards and was very stiff all the time). I didnt start ergo racing until 6 months after my first disk bulge (L4/L5) in 2001 - I am mad!

Mike - that a big jump in performance on the 10 x 1min r1. Perhaps thats why it felt so hard this time. 30mins r20 is never one of my favourites, and any tiredness in the legs really shows up. Like you say having a rest day or two could be the answer. I used to be in the same situation with donating blood - something I feel passionate about but was a temporary step back in ergo intensity.

Marjorie - thanks for the confidence in my performance but I am not really considering how fast I could go at 60, LWT or not, (any British records available will have been snaffled long before that occurs in 2025)! I am only looking at 2017/8 at present and hoping not to loose more than 2 secs per year on 2k, (which might be even less deficit if I actually did 2k training wholeheartedly :? ). I expect that you are already on the piste - so happy hols and wishing you all the best in OTW and ergo races that you have planned.

Me - very happy with my 16k on Tuesday when I did 2:15.3 pace for 72 mins 10 secs, (the target of beating 2:15.4 looked out of reach 5k to go so had to raise the game and go for a negative split bigger than originally planned). B) Thursday's "Performance Grid" - one of my personal trainers ideas that I resurrected, (18, 20, 22, 24, 26 spm over 2500m, 2k, 1500m, 1k, 500m with rests that shrink from 1 min 45 secs by 15 secs each time.) Got the stroke rate right but one of my worst performances at this - 2:15.0 average, (perhaps I am dead legged too). :oops: Followed with a 25 min blast on the exercise bike. Today is a rest in preparation for Saturdays 18k and Sundays 5 mile cross-country run. :D PS Last 3 sessions I have been 0.3kg over the LWT limit so need to concentrate the mind and keep my hands off chocolate :( otherwise I wont get any breakfast pre-race.
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