PM update

Maintenance, accessories, operation. Anything to do with making your erg work.
bob01
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PM update

Post by bob01 » September 13th, 2018, 9:39 am

Hi. I know some from C2 read this forum, and anyone else that would like to chuck their 2p or 2 cents in!!

Just wondering when the next or upgraded PM will be on the horizon?

I think the current versions leave a lot to be desired

# Functionality
#Averaging of stroke and heart rate really is not good enough
#A lot more info could be given... not just limited to ergdata parameters
# stroke efficiency score perhaps!! ( wattbike PES)
etc etc.

I suspect before long the PM will disappear to be replace by owners tablet (difficult for commercial gyms but provision for both could be engineered in)

I believe that the Erg and PMs would have these and others factors installed if Concept 2 was not to a large extent a monopoly (it by most deffinitions is) and acts in a monopolistic way. I appreciate there is a lot less money in erging as opposed to cycling BUT so much more available in the cycling market with its competition.

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jackarabit
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Re: PM update

Post by jackarabit » September 13th, 2018, 12:28 pm

Creating, nurturing and servicing a niche fitness machine market for 40+ yrs. is a monopolistic activity? Used to be called minding the store!
There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

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bob01
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Re: PM update

Post by bob01 » September 13th, 2018, 1:35 pm

I didn't raise this point to argue with anyone. I hoped perhaps it might stimulate a constructive dialogue: one in which hopefully might result in Concept2 to become better.

So you are happy for them not to be innovative?. They are not minding the store they are relying on their unique position in the market. Very little has changed over decades.

Giving an average hr that isn't..... giving an average stroke rate that often is not.. that's acceptable??? to my mind it is not

As said if they faced competition they would be more regular improvements. The two examples above could be addressed quite simply via software upgrades

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Carl Watts
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Re: PM update

Post by Carl Watts » September 13th, 2018, 5:48 pm

Most of what your asking for has already been covered and requested years ago.

There will not be another new monitor for ages. Expect each new one to be around for 10 years.

Even for me, someone who was very slow to adopt the smart phone, primarily because its simply too big and battery life is useless can see that the "Monitor" can be replaced by an App now.
Carl Watts.
Age:52 Weight: 104kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log

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johnlvs2run
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Re: PM update

Post by johnlvs2run » September 13th, 2018, 6:38 pm

Maybe this is already possible. It would be neat if the pm5 could be connected with
a much larger computer or projection monitor, so the display could be seen from farther away.
73 5'8 155
age 70+ world record pace per weight percentages
skierg: 100m 87.4 / 500m 86.2 / 1k 84.7 / 2k 88.2 / 5k 87.6 / 10k 89.4 / 60' 92.0 / 21k 93.6
my training log

Slidewinder
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Re: PM update

Post by Slidewinder » September 13th, 2018, 6:42 pm

You are quite right bob01. Concept 2's market dominance in this area has stifled innovation. Compare the huge advances in cycling technology in the last 35 years to that of the glacial pace of advances in rowing ergometer technology over the same time period. But then, cyclists embrace innovations and are always excited to try new approaches. By contrast, rowing ergometer users ridicule new ideas. The common attitude is that if Concept 2 hasn't thought of it, or implemented it, then the idea, whatever it is, must be of no merit.

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Carl Watts
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Re: PM update

Post by Carl Watts » September 13th, 2018, 8:11 pm

johnlvs2run wrote:
September 13th, 2018, 6:38 pm
Maybe this is already possible. It would be neat if the pm5 could be connected with
a much larger computer or projection monitor, so the display could be seen from farther away.
You can, the software is called RowPro.

It gives you all the info you need and more, but thats not really the best part. The best part is the live interactive rowing with full graphics with others from around the world.
Carl Watts.
Age:52 Weight: 104kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log

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johnlvs2run
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Re: PM update

Post by johnlvs2run » September 13th, 2018, 8:26 pm

johnlvs2run wrote:
September 13th, 2018, 6:38 pm
Maybe this is already possible. It would be neat if the pm5 could be connected with
a much larger computer or projection monitor, so the display could be seen from farther away.
Carl Watts wrote:
September 13th, 2018, 8:11 pm
You can, the software is called RowPro. It gives you all the info you need and more, but thats not really the best part. The best part is the live interactive rowing with full graphics with others from around the world.
What I mean is to show a larger display of the PM5 monitor, on a computer monitor or projection monitor farther away, so vision can be expanded and be more relaxed. As far as I can tell, Rowpro is a program that requires Microsoft Windows, which I don't use, and doesn't do that anyway.
73 5'8 155
age 70+ world record pace per weight percentages
skierg: 100m 87.4 / 500m 86.2 / 1k 84.7 / 2k 88.2 / 5k 87.6 / 10k 89.4 / 60' 92.0 / 21k 93.6
my training log

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Carl Watts
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Re: PM update

Post by Carl Watts » September 13th, 2018, 10:07 pm

RowPro has the "Twin Screen" so yes its a larger version of the PM display.

There is also a Mac version of RowPro now as well.

Sure its not an exact replica of the display, but how much information do you need ? it also has the live rating for you and others rowing in the older version.

Some people clearly don't need all the data possible thrown at them. In reality all I use is the pace, projected finish and the rating and heartrate during 30 minute sessions.
Carl Watts.
Age:52 Weight: 104kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log

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johnlvs2run
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Re: PM update

Post by johnlvs2run » September 13th, 2018, 10:16 pm

The pm5 display information is quite fine for me on it's own. I use Linux.

What would be neat is to run a cord to a large LCD display monitor, that shows a duplicate of the pm5 information.

Especially with the Skierg, this would greatly expand my field of vision.
73 5'8 155
age 70+ world record pace per weight percentages
skierg: 100m 87.4 / 500m 86.2 / 1k 84.7 / 2k 88.2 / 5k 87.6 / 10k 89.4 / 60' 92.0 / 21k 93.6
my training log

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jackarabit
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Re: PM update

Post by jackarabit » September 13th, 2018, 11:24 pm

ErgData, the FREE ios app from CONCEPT 2, can be mirrored from apple blab slabs or ipods to any size TV by mirroring thru Apple TV device.
There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

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Slidewinder
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Re: PM update

Post by Slidewinder » September 14th, 2018, 9:15 am

bob01 asks, "So you are happy for them (Concept 2) not to be innovative?" bob01 is probably asking for C2 to be something it no longer is, or is even capable of being. As I wrote in another thread, Concept 2 presently has no patents either active or pending in the field of rowing exercise technology - not a sign of a creatively vigorous R & D program.

Indisputably, Concept 2 was an innovative company during the first ten years of its existence. Back in the 80's, the principals at C2 were young and hungry, full of ideas and ambition. Things are different now. With age, comfort, public recognition, and financial success, it is very difficult to sustain the youthful creative energy and drive of a distant yesteryear.

The wonder is that there is still a widespread public perception that Concept 2 remains an innovative company. As Mark Twain said, "Once a man has a reputation as an early riser, he can sleep 'til noon."

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Anth_F
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Re: PM update

Post by Anth_F » September 14th, 2018, 9:23 am

Have you nothing better to do than lurk around here jumping in every thread to spew loads of negative babble about the C2 company and their product ? :lol:
41yo male 5'10 78kg (Rowing since june 9th 2016) PB's 5k 19:22

My goals are simply to keep fit/get fitter and continue to enjoy rowing on the C2 :)

https://log.concept2.com/log

Slidewinder
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Re: PM update

Post by Slidewinder » September 14th, 2018, 10:07 am

+Anth_F: There are exceptions (Picasso, Frank LLoyd Wright, come immediately to mind), but it is very rare for anyone to remain creative and innovative throughout the arc of their lifetime. A few years ago Bob Dylan was asked where he got his new material, after all, living in luxury on his splendid estate, how could he still write about being "on the road" and feeling "like a rolling stone". He answered, "Out of the box." (meaning his "new" songs came out of his files from the 60's)

If you were to ask Concept 2 where it got the idea for the C2 dynamic ergometer, you would receive the Bob Dylan answer. If you were to assert that C2's development of the SkiErg shows that Concept 2 is still infused with its original innovative spirit, you would be wrong. Both these products are old Concept 2 ideas from decades ago. The idea for the SkiErg dates back to the time of the Model A.

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Carl Watts
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Re: PM update

Post by Carl Watts » September 14th, 2018, 5:22 pm

Anth_F wrote:
September 14th, 2018, 9:23 am
Have you nothing better to do than lurk around here jumping in every thread to spew loads of negative babble about the C2 company and their product ? :lol:
Clearly he has a beef with Concept 2. Who else can resight C2 patient numbers ? Probably not a good idea to get on your competitors Website and start barking away, thats sales 101, you never put down the competition you make a better product and then sell it.

Pretty sure all the regulars on here are pretty happy with their Concept 2 rower, but being an Engineer it needed a couple of minor tweaks but thats it. Always happy to look at an alternative rower, but the C2 is the whole package and so far I don't see a replacement on the market for it.
Carl Watts.
Age:52 Weight: 104kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log

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