Pb's Vs Resistance Settings

[old] FireGuy · Post by **[old] FireGuy** » February 19th, 2005, 8:04 pm

If training I set my ower on a resistance setting of 10 do I drop it down for ranking time

[old] ninthman · Post by **[old] ninthman** » February 20th, 2005, 3:14 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FireGuy @ Feb 19 2005, 08:04 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>If training I set my ower on a resistance setting of 10 do I drop it down for ranking time <br /> </td></tr></table><br />You can row at whatever damper/resistance/fan settting you like, so long as it stays the same throughout the piece.<br /><br />(I'd strongly advise against doing a lot of work at setting 10.)

[old] bsemaiktehr · Post by **[old] bsemaiktehr** » February 21st, 2005, 12:42 am

Most people I have talked to don't suggest a 10 dampener setting on any piece longer than a 500 - but it depends on your brute strength vs. your endurance<br /><br />People with really good endurance can row at a very high SR at a lower dampener setting and acheive similar results to someone with a low SR and a very high dampener setting. It varies from person to person.<br /><br /><br />P.S.<br /><br />Ninthman - a 7:00 flat 2k time is damn good for a cox!

[old] ninthman · Post by **[old] ninthman** » February 21st, 2005, 1:21 am

I hate damper 10 rowing. It seems so far from what a boat (<i>any</i> boat, even a coxed pair) feels like. I have an instinctive dislike of it, partially stemming from the fact that all the idiots I have to erg next to in the gym row at "10" (usually palms up, doing a curl motion with their arms).

[old] ja34 · Post by **[old] ja34** » February 21st, 2005, 7:24 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ninthman @ Feb 20 2005, 02:14 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FireGuy @ Feb 19 2005, 08:04 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>If training I set my ower on a resistance setting of 10 do I drop it down for ranking time <br /> </td></tr></table><br />You can row at whatever damper/resistance/fan settting you like, so long as it stays the same throughout the piece.<br /><br />(I'd strongly advise against doing a lot of work at setting 10.) <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />Somehow I find that I pull better times for steady state ie 30min, 10 and HM (82 mins) rows if the setting is on 8. I'm 6'2" and lightweight - will my times improve if I lower the setting? Or is it a matter of personal preference or technique?<br /><br />Jim

[old] FrankJ · Post by **[old] FrankJ** » February 21st, 2005, 10:07 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ja34 @ Feb 21 2005, 11:24 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><br />Somehow I find that I pull better times for steady state ie 30min, 10 and HM (82 mins) rows if the setting is on 8. I'm 6'2" and lightweight - will my times improve if I lower the setting? Or is it a matter of personal preference or technique?<br /><br />Jim <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Jim,<br /><br />It depends. I would expect that initially you would go slower but once you've learned to row at a lower damper setting you will most likely be faster. Let me try to explain what is happening.<br /><br />The real number here is not damper setting but DF (drag factor) which is calculated by the PM2 or PM3. Look here for an explanation: <a href='http://concept2.com/update/S2002/drag.htm' target='_blank'>Concept 2 Drag Factor</a>. With a higher DF the flywheel slows more quickly therefore it is easier to catch at the beginning of the next stroke. Since it has higher drag is is also harder to accelerate therefore it feels heavier than with a lower DF. You tend to take fewer but harder strokes.<br /><br />With a lower DF the flywheel is easier to spin and slows down less between strokes. That makes it harder to catch at the start of your stroke especially if you're use to higher DF and a slower flywheel. When I started rowing I always set the damper at 10 but now the only time I use a high damper setting is to cool down when I'm rowing slowly. With a CBreeze the high damper allows more cooling air to flow through and that helps cool me down.<br /><br />My suggestion to you is to try rowing with damper set a couple of notches lower but keep the pace constant. Once you have mastered that level reduce it another couple of notches until you can row at a damper 1. Once you can do that move back up until you find your optimum setting. It will take some experimenting but the results are worth it.<br /><br />Frank

[old] tomhz · Post by **[old] tomhz** » February 21st, 2005, 11:46 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(bsemaiktehr @ Feb 21 2005, 04:42 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>People with really good endurance can row at a very high SR at a lower dampener setting and acheive similar results to someone with a low SR and a very high dampener setting. It varies from person to person.<br /> <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />You don't need a higher stroke rate to achieve good results with low damper settings. With any damper setting you can reach high stroke forces. At lower damper settings the flywheel speed will be higher and this will provide (require) the stroke force you need to go equally fast at the same stroke rate. The only difference is the handle speed during the stroke. <br />The question is: can you have you muscles work fast enough to provide the same stroke force at higher handle speed. That requires some skill and (sometimes a lot) practise!!<br /><br />Tom

[old] FireGuy · Post by **[old] FireGuy** » February 21st, 2005, 2:16 pm

I started working out with the rower a week ago and after reading the site atempted 10,000m and left it set at 10 I did it but it kicked my butt. I probably should have worked my way up before trying a 10,000.

[old] SimonB · Post by **[old] SimonB** » February 21st, 2005, 3:21 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(FireGuy @ Feb 21 2005, 01:16 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I started working out with the rower a week ago and after reading the site atempted 10,000m and left it set at 10 I did it but it kicked my butt. I probably should have worked my way up before trying a 10,000. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi FG<br /><br />When I first started indoor rowing, I would also always row at with the damper set to 10. If I set it lower, my times would increase and "It would seem to easy". A DS of 10 would kick my butt as well. I would think that I was some how cheating or not getting the benefit unless I had it cranked up to 10.<br /><br />Having read many posts on the forum about lower drag factors and strapless / 10 meters per stroke, I decided to seriously give lower drag factors ago. <br /><br />Rowing at lower drag factors has allowed me to:<br /><br />1. Lowered my stroke rate<br />2. Increased my power.<br />3. Row faster paces<br />4. Made my stroke more efficient.<br /><br />However, rowing at 10 allowed me to build up some strength after a couple of years of relative inactivity on the erg. So it cuts both ways.<br /><br />After 9 Weeks of rowing at lower drag, I have knocked 20 seconds off my 500m pace. Obviously this is not all down to lower drag, but I know it has helped get me there. I doubt I could row those paces at the higher drag without eventually hurting my lower back.<br /><br />Good luck with your rowing.<br />

[old] ja34 · Post by **[old] ja34** » February 23rd, 2005, 9:42 am

<br />[/quote]<br /><br />Jim,<br /><br />It depends. I would expect that initially you would go slower but once you've learned to row at a lower damper setting you will most likely be faster. Let me try to explain what is happening.<br /><br />The real number here is not damper setting but DF (drag factor) which is calculated by the PM2 or PM3. Look here for an explanation: <a href='http://concept2.com/update/S2002/drag.htm' target='_blank'>Concept 2 Drag Factor</a>. With a higher DF the flywheel slows more quickly therefore it is easier to catch at the beginning of the next stroke. Since it has higher drag is is also harder to accelerate therefore it feels heavier than with a lower DF. You tend to take fewer but harder strokes.<br /><br />With a lower DF the flywheel is easier to spin and slows down less between strokes. That makes it harder to catch at the start of your stroke especially if you're use to higher DF and a slower flywheel. When I started rowing I always set the damper at 10 but now the only time I use a high damper setting is to cool down when I'm rowing slowly. With a CBreeze the high damper allows more cooling air to flow through and that helps cool me down.<br /><br />My suggestion to you is to try rowing with damper set a couple of notches lower but keep the pace constant. Once you have mastered that level reduce it another couple of notches until you can row at a damper 1. Once you can do that move back up until you find your optimum setting. It will take some experimenting but the results are worth it.<br /><br />Frank <br />[/quote]<br /><br /><br /><br />Thanks for your suggestions - I'll give it a go.<br /><br />Jim

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