Time Course Of Training Adaptations

[old] NealW · Post by **[old] NealW** » November 22nd, 2004, 2:28 am

I'm looking for more specific examples in LT training ala Dr. Seiler's MAAP article on "<a href='http://home.hia.no/~stephens/timecors.htm' target='_blank'>The Time Course of Training Adaptions.</a>". Specifically, I'm 24, 6'3" and 220lb and have the hopefully not unrealistic goal of making the US National team inside the next 2 years. In 07/03, after 5 years of training and directly before an 11 month break from rowing ("couch potato city"), I was erging a 6:08 2k. My LT was ~170 bpm and my rowing HRM was at 191. I had about 15 hours a week training, most on the water, with 2 rest days every other week. Coming back to the sport this June, I erged a 6:53 and my LT/HRM measured 135/174. I began with 5 erg sessions a week. After 5 months of training, I'm erging a 6:35 and my LT/HRM measure 159/179. I'm now doing 8 erg sessions and one circuit session for a total of about 6 hours a week. Ignoring the incongruities of the change in my max heart rate, and assuming that I started in June was almost at base, can you derive a time table (to include milestones and needed changes in training) from this info to get me back to where I was last summer (or closer to the PTC)? I don't have notes to compare from college, but if I did, I'm certain the efficiency issues would play more a role than physical adaption on improving erg scores. The numbers I'm seeing here are therefore atypical when compared to those of a novice rower. They still seem very lax. I've seen in Rowing News little blurbs about former elite rowers who've been on the "beer diet" for a year or so getting back on the erg. Have there been more formal papers on the subject. Onto the issue of the HRM change: the large decrease I observed in my HRM isn't addressed in any articles I've seen as a training (or lack thereof) adaption. If it's mentioned in the literature at all, it's usually given as a linear value inversly related with age. I think the collection method may also be strongly correlated with AT, but assuming otherwise and my HRM calculations are correct (using <a href='http://www.concept2.co.uk/training/tels_tales.php?id=3' target='_blank'>Terry O'Neill's method</a>), what are other possible causes? Regards, Neal Williams

[old] Kudos · Post by **[old] Kudos** » November 22nd, 2004, 6:42 am

Hey Neal: I would say your likely hood of making the national team decreases significantly unless you are actively involved with some form of elite coaching and competition of which to push you in the right direction. All this HR/training periodization/LT&AT stuff is fun and productive; but its not going to get you to PTC by itself. You may need to make major life changes, but the faster you get yourself to an elite program, the faster you will make the national team. I am doing it alone right now, training 3 times a day, becasue I have to make enough money to A) pay off my boatB) pay off my car and C) build enough savings to have about 3 mths or so of jobless income to get situated near an elite program.

[old] eurofoot13 · Post by **[old] eurofoot13** » November 22nd, 2004, 3:17 pm

Speaking of which, I have really been meaning to talk to some of you elite rowers about your experiences. What is it like rowing internationally? I really want to know what to expect....

[old] jamesg · Post by **[old] jamesg** » November 23rd, 2004, 5:02 am

You row for months in ice, rain, fog, snow, even heat if you're lucky, and pain everywhere; with only cox and coach to shout at you. Then on the day there's another million shouting too. The day after you suffer withdrawal symptoms.

[old] eurofoot13 · Post by **[old] eurofoot13** » November 23rd, 2004, 1:28 pm

Okay. Sounds like the experience of a lifetime.

[old] JosephNovak · Post by **[old] JosephNovak** » November 24th, 2004, 1:24 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Then on the day there's another million shouting too. </td></tr></table> A million, james?! Okay, you didn't row for America. From the article, <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Peak values for maximal oxygen consumption and lactate threshold stabilized after only 2 or 3 years in these hard training athletes. </td></tr></table> So even if you did "started in June was almost at base" ("ALL YOUR BASE ALL ARE MINE"), you should be able to peak in 2 years. I don't have your goals, but I've come back from 6 months off and made up the training no problem. Then there's Lance Armstrong. And he did it with only ONE NUT. I think Kudos has the right track. Plan out your racing to get into an elite program first. What's holding you back is the 6 hours a weak (sp;). You're not going to find anyone to back up what you're incinuating -- that your previous "adaptions" are hindering you now. Forget about MHR too -- It doesn't give you anything when you already have your LT. And if all else fails, cut off a nut and see if that helps. Or go train with Kudos. Kudos, are you up for a partner? Do you have both nuts? Or let Xeno "Pump YOU UP!" Joe

[old] NealW · Post by **[old] NealW** » November 25th, 2004, 8:29 pm

Thanks everyone for the kick in the rear. I counted 2 Joe, right where they should be. Regards, Neal Williams

[old] Kudos · Post by **[old] Kudos** » November 25th, 2004, 11:05 pm

Let me check real quick......they are both still there. I could always use a partner although, most people can't put up with my schedule. As suprisingly easy as it is, I train at 6am and 7pm, it has no wiggle room, I don't like to compromise or change times. Its okay though, I'll be all set once C2 upgrades e-row so I can use it with my PM3 and erg with all the others nutso's on here.

[old] NealW · Post by **[old] NealW** » November 26th, 2004, 10:35 pm

~~I train at 6am and 7pm, it has no wiggle room~~ Your 6am is probably my 9am, so it may be doable. ~~with all the others nutso's~~ Good one.

[old] Coach Gus · Post by **[old] Coach Gus** » November 26th, 2004, 10:51 pm

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td class='genmed'>QUOTE (Kudos @ Nov 25 2004, 07:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Its okay though, I'll be all set once C2 upgrades e-row so I can use it with my PM3 and erg with all the others nutso's on here.  </td></tr></table> I'm pretty sure C2 doesn't have any plans to upgrade e-row to work with the PM3. They seem to be leaving it up to RowPro to take on online rowing with the PM3.

[old] Kudos · Post by **[old] Kudos** » November 27th, 2004, 8:22 am

I see, where can I get rowpro? Is it up and running yet? Are there lots of people online? How many pocket protectors do I need to wear in order to feel like "one of the group?"

[old] JosephNovak · Post by **[old] JosephNovak** » November 27th, 2004, 4:15 pm

Rowpro is developed by <a href='http://www.digitalrowing.com/' target='_blank'>Digital Rowing</a>. I think I got an eval copy w/ my PM3 upgrade, but I don't have windows.... Here's another <a href='http://www.concept2.co.uk/rower/rowpro.php' target='_blank'>link</a> from C2. I don't think the question is HOW MANY pocket protectors, but WHERE you wear them, mister I can count to two without using my fingers. Does anyone know if C2 is planning a linux dev kit or if anyone has started the reverse engineering? Joe