Pondering the Beginner Pete Plan

[p_b82]

For me and for most people, a lower rate with the same splits lowers the heart rate. It also trains a stronger stroke.

IMO 3 sessions a week of rowing is too little for very significant gains. Athletes in club-level in my university complain that 3x a week is too little for context.

I think you need to be very careful with sweeping generalisations like this.

There is always a cut-off point where a person's genetic make-up flips from higher work per stroke / lower rate to lower work per stroke / higher rate.

I am actually willing to bet, as a lightweight, you could actually run a higher rate for the same pace for the same HR response - you've just spent months only doing low rate, so your body has adapted. (which is why it is not good to only do the same rate all the time)

My "sweet spot" is actually r23 - but it is an individual thing.

And on point 2 - if a person keeps rowing 3x a week they will make significant improvements if the rowing effort is well focused. - it will take a little longer than some-one else doing more per week, but it is enough with 3x hard sessions as you don't need to factor in additional recovery. (One's peak on 3x will be lower than one with 5/6/7x - but one can make big gains still)

don't forget that there's also different metrics than just a 2k race...

My first row 2k (in 10mins) on 29/06/22 -> 42k on 02/04/24; that's a single session improvement of 40k in under 2 years. I'd class that as significant! (and apart from a back injury 4 months of the FM training was 3x a week, & as I took 2 weeks out for the injury, my last 6 weeks had those missed 6 sessions added in to make it 4x a week for the run into marathon day).
I've improved my 2k by 35s & my 30min by 575m - also imo not insignificant improvements....

[Nomark]

Another day another 10k. And I'm finally feeling some stamina come back. First time that it didn't feel like a struggle for the third quarter and I managed to finish strongly. It's still true what I used to say, when you do 4k (intervals) at sub 2:00, 10k at 2:20 and below feels much easier!

Code: Select all

Time	Meters	Pace	Watts	Cal/Hr	S/M
45:39.0	10,000	2:16.9	136	768	22
9:08.2	2,000	2:17.0	136	767	23
9:10.5	4,000	2:17.6	134	762	22
9:14.8	6,000	2:18.7	131	751	23
9:08.4	8,000	2:17.1	136	767	22
8:57.1	10,000	2:14.2	145	797	22

Stroke rate was a little high and I actually got quicker when I slowed down and put more power in each stroke, but otherwise very happy tonight. Beat my previous best of 2:19.1 comfortably.

[iain]

Today I managed 2:07, 2:06, 2:06, 2:03 2k for 4*2000m 4R at r24 all intervals. Is this bad compared to my ~7100m 30r20?

The long intervals in Pete's plans are intended to be done close to maximal. Pete says 4 x 2k is around 5k+0.5S/500m (admittedly open rate). So you are saying that you did the broadly 5k paced intervals R24 at about the same pace as 30R20 when I would have hoped for faster than free rate (maybe R24?) 30' that will be faster than 30R20, particularly for a lightweight. Subjecvt oif course to how recovered you are and the heat and humidity this is done in.

[PleaseLockIn]

Today I managed 2:07, 2:06, 2:06, 2:03 2k for 4*2000m 4R at r24 all intervals. Is this bad compared to my ~7100m 30r20?

The long intervals in Pete's plans are intended to be done close to maximal. Pete says 4 x 2k is around 5k+0.5S/500m (admittedly open rate). So you are saying that you did the broadly 5k paced intervals R24 at about the same pace as 30R20 when I would have hoped for faster than free rate (maybe R24?) 30' that will be faster than 30R20, particularly for a lightweight. Subjecvt oif course to how recovered you are and the heat and humidity this is done in.

Not very recovered and I did the 4x 2k in hot and humid weather. Tired too - had personal issues to deal with.

The 5k + 0.5 is with 5 minutes rest not 4 minutes. My nutrion was also quite poor - pizza and I almost vomited in multiple occasions. I was also stressed from a personal issue. I barely finished it…

I do think my R24 30’ will be significantly faster.

When I did the first interval a bit faster than 2:07, my HR was ~180 after 8 minutes. In the 30R20 it hit that at 5 minutes.

So higher rates let me ease a bit, and it confirms why sometimes when things go badly in 30R20 I raise rate to 21 or even 22-23 in the end. Ik as long as the average is r20 this is probably fine

[iain]

do think my R24 30’ will be significantly faster.

When I did the first interval a bit faster than 2:07, my HR was ~180 after 8 minutes. In the 30R20 it hit that at 5 minutes.

Great, might be worth a try at 30R24 as, in a 30R20 you should face issues with muscle fatigue, the 30R24 should help ensure that you have sufficient aerobic capacity so that you don't struggle excessively with this as well!

Depending on what you do in the rests, I don't think going from 5 to 4 min makes much difference and so I always use 4'. The 5' was already a reduction on the WP although Mike calls for only a minimal break with most rest done active and so having a slower effect (although possibly reaching a higher amount due to the benefits of maintaining blood flow). That said, people report a spread of how 2k compares with their 5k. Mentally they are very different challenges. Personally fine to have some workouts effected by real life it happens to all of us, so don't get dejected, but you asked the question and I would say the 30R20 was a significantly better result, not why!

[Nomark]

Week 3.2 of my 5 week mini plan done. 10k after a rest day was fast. New seasons best. Tried to keep the stroke rate down and it mostly worked. Much better split consistency meaning my stamina is up and I'm not tiring in the second half anymore. Probably 800m reps up next. Maybe 1500s.

Code: Select all

Time	Meters	Pace	Watts	Cal/Hr	S/M
44:35.2	10,000	2:13.7	146	803	22
8:55.3	2,000	2:13.8	146	802	22
8:55.5	4,000	2:13.8	146	802	22
8:53.9	6,000	2:13.4	147	806	22
8:54.3	8,000	2:13.5	147	805	22
8:56.1	10,000	2:14.0	145	800	23

[reuben]

I'm just dropping back in to encourage Nomark, PLI, and newcomer grahamf.

Graham - I'm 67, so not far behind you, and I recently completed the BPP. For what it's worth, I did just the 3 core sessions per week. I had good days and mediocre days, but no truly bad days. Motivation waxed and waned, which contributed to the good/mediocre days. Some days it was more of a struggle to strap in than it was to actually complete the session!

It took me several weeks to develop something resembling a decent stroke. I could feel a hitch in my stroke, which was confirmed by a glitch in the force curve. Technique matters, but since you rowed in uni that probably wont be as much of an issue for you.

Recovery also matters, especially as we, uh, become more mature.

You can do it.

[grahamf]

I'm just dropping back in to encourage Nomark, PLI, and newcomer grahamf.

Thank you for the encouragement, Reuben. I certainly understand what you mean about the main struggle some days is just to strap in. That is so, so true!

And I am very pleased to hear that you have successfully completed the plan. That really does make me want to stick with it.