How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

General discussion on Training. How to get better on your erg, how to use your erg to get better at another sport, or anything else about improving your abilities.
Sakly
Half Marathon Poster
Posts: 3906
Joined: January 13th, 2022, 10:49 am

Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by Sakly » June 17th, 2025, 4:20 am

Ombrax wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 3:20 am
Ombrax wrote:
June 16th, 2025, 8:03 pm
In my case, going to bed slightly hungry is the way to go. Takes a while, but it works.
Fixed a typo.
Hehe, but the former version is not wrong at all. You should only eat when hungry, not "when it's time". And you should only eat until you're full, not until your plate is empty (aside from eating the right stuff, but that's a whole other topic). If you follow these two rules, then overweight should never get a problem.
As many eating habits have their roots in what you've learned as a kid and also often depend on social interactions as a kind of event...it turns out to be different in many cases.
Male - '80 - 82kg - 177cm - Start rowErg Jan 2022
1': 358m
4': 1217m
30'r20: 8068m
30': 8,283m
60': 16,222m
100m: 0:15.9
500m: 1:26.0
1k: 3:07.8
2k: 6:37.1
5k: 17:26.2
6k: 21:03.5
10k: 36:01.5
HM: 1:18:40.1
FM: 2:47:07.0
My log

old wobbler
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Posts: 30
Joined: March 5th, 2025, 7:17 am

Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by old wobbler » June 17th, 2025, 4:50 am

Ombrax wrote:
June 16th, 2025, 8:03 pm
old wobbler wrote:
June 16th, 2025, 11:11 am
I am rowing to lose weight, building my knee muscles up to try and help not having knee replacements or be fit enough to have knee replacement.
You probably already know this, but I"ll repeat it just the same: I've found that the simplest way to lose weight is to not take in as many calories - eating something then working hard on the erg to burn it off is much harder, mostly because unless we're talking about running, the human body is really efficient at exercising while not burning too many calories. In my case, going to be slightly hungry is the way to go. Takes a while, but it works.

For your other fitness goals, the rower is a great tool.

Good Luck
I have for 3 years lived on between 1100 and 1600 callories. I've cut out all the 'crap' eat more veg and fruit than I ever did. Its why I do a lot of Zone 1 and 2 rowing as that burns fat more than higher zones.

old wobbler
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Posts: 30
Joined: March 5th, 2025, 7:17 am

Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by old wobbler » June 17th, 2025, 4:54 am

jamesg wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 1:32 am
No matter what I do I cant seem to get faster or produce more watts.
Some of your notes are scary: 107kg on 5'10 (178cm) height gives BMI 33. What's your doc's say? Cholesterol? I've had surgeons working on me three time now thanks to that stuff.
My Doc is happy for me to row and exercise. 5.4 and dropping now I have shed eating crisps. (chips or 'laytes' in other languages.) Sorry that you have had a bad run with health issues. One plus side, I dont drink alcohol and havent since 1981 nor do I smoke.

old wobbler
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Joined: March 5th, 2025, 7:17 am

Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by old wobbler » June 17th, 2025, 4:58 am

Sakly wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 4:20 am
Ombrax wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 3:20 am
Ombrax wrote:
June 16th, 2025, 8:03 pm
In my case, going to bed slightly hungry is the way to go. Takes a while, but it works.
Fixed a typo.
Hehe, but the former version is not wrong at all. You should only eat when hungry, not "when it's time". And you should only eat until you're full, not until your plate is empty (aside from eating the right stuff, but that's a whole other topic). If you follow these two rules, then overweight should never get a problem.
As many eating habits have their roots in what you've learned as a kid and also often depend on social interactions as a kind of event...it turns out to be different in many cases.
Worked shifts for 46 years. Eat meals at the wrong times (eating dinner when you first wake up is no fun.) I was fine till I was 53 and my knee went. Doctors told me to stop sports and just watch TV. 10 years later I am diabetic, had a BMI of 35, out of breath and feeling old. 5 months later I am much fitter, weight coming down and I am not out of breath plus have started to live again. This is working for me.

Dangerscouse
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Joined: April 27th, 2014, 11:11 am
Location: Liverpool, England

Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by Dangerscouse » June 17th, 2025, 5:31 am

If I was you I'd row using RPE and use your intuition. I wonder if you're hindering your progress as you're trying to use technology too much.

Keep it simple and see if that helps.
51 HWT; 6' 4"; 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:19; 6k= 20:47; 10k= 35:46 30mins= 8,488m 60mins= 16,618m HM= 1:16.47; FM= 2:40:41; 50k= 3:16:09; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you row"

Instagram: stuwenman

Sakly
Half Marathon Poster
Posts: 3906
Joined: January 13th, 2022, 10:49 am

Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by Sakly » June 17th, 2025, 6:00 am

old wobbler wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 4:58 am
Sakly wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 4:20 am
Ombrax wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 3:20 am


Fixed a typo.
Hehe, but the former version is not wrong at all. You should only eat when hungry, not "when it's time". And you should only eat until you're full, not until your plate is empty (aside from eating the right stuff, but that's a whole other topic). If you follow these two rules, then overweight should never get a problem.
As many eating habits have their roots in what you've learned as a kid and also often depend on social interactions as a kind of event...it turns out to be different in many cases.
Worked shifts for 46 years. Eat meals at the wrong times (eating dinner when you first wake up is no fun.) I was fine till I was 53 and my knee went. Doctors told me to stop sports and just watch TV. 10 years later I am diabetic, had a BMI of 35, out of breath and feeling old. 5 months later I am much fitter, weight coming down and I am not out of breath plus have started to live again. This is working for me.
Work shifts are an evil invention! Understand this can lead to potential problems for daily life in many aspects.
But as I said, eating habits not directly linked to "I am hungry and need food" are the main cause and when you write "eating dinner when you first wake up is no fun" seems to point exactly in this direction - it's a learned habit, not a need (otherwise you would feel it to be fun at least). Social aspects, such as to have dinner with family play also a role, but don't make it better or healthy.
Sports activities are not necessarily needed to maintain a healthy weight, but to maintain a healthy body, if sedentary otherwise.
Overweight and T2D are mainly linked to diet (here we could also starting about what one eats...), not missing sports/activities.

In the end it does not matter at all for the individual. You need to find what works for you and you seem to be on a very good route right now :)
Male - '80 - 82kg - 177cm - Start rowErg Jan 2022
1': 358m
4': 1217m
30'r20: 8068m
30': 8,283m
60': 16,222m
100m: 0:15.9
500m: 1:26.0
1k: 3:07.8
2k: 6:37.1
5k: 17:26.2
6k: 21:03.5
10k: 36:01.5
HM: 1:18:40.1
FM: 2:47:07.0
My log

H2O
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Location: Frankfurt, GER
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Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by H2O » June 17th, 2025, 8:17 am

328W @32 is 10 Watt per stroke.
For me 10 Watt per stroke is high powered.
If I row 10 Watt per stroke I blow through HR 109 within one minute on stroke rate 17.

This is OK and I compensate by taking enough break, e.g recently 10 x (3 mins / rest 1 min), watt per stroke: 10.6, stroke rate 17-18.
HR creeps up from rep to rep and reaches 131 at the end of the last rep, however falls below 90 at the end of each rest period.
Average HR is around 125.
If I want to keep the HR at 109, I have to drop the stroke power to 8W per stroke, stroke rate 17.

To keep the HR as low as possible I would focus on relaxation, two breaths per stroke.
I have noticed that overreaching (shins past vertical, longer stroke) but reducing the peak power can lower the HR by a few beats
(at the same pace).

Age 67, 1K @3:23

alex9026
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Posts: 756
Joined: September 11th, 2022, 1:24 pm

Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by alex9026 » June 17th, 2025, 9:58 am

Dangerscouse wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 5:31 am
If I was you I'd row using RPE and use your intuition. I wonder if you're hindering your progress as you're trying to use technology too much.

Keep it simple and see if that helps.
+1 on this suggestion. It's so easy to get bogged down in to training zones, heart rate, watts (do people actually use this data point during sessions?) etc to the point we really lose sight of the bigger picture.
34 6'2 88kg
1:00 368m
500m 1:24.4
4:00 1282m
2k 6:24
5k 17:27
6k 20:57

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Ombrax
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Re: How to improve watts/distance and stay within heart rate......

Post by Ombrax » June 17th, 2025, 6:46 pm

alex9026 wrote:
June 17th, 2025, 9:58 am
+1 on this suggestion. It's so easy to get bogged down in to training zones, heart rate, watts (do people actually use this data point during sessions?) etc to the point we really lose sight of the bigger picture.
I agree, and thought the same thing - IMO the OP may be fixating too much on HR and specific zones. Unless you're doing a highly structured training plan and keeping track of all the details, I think it's so much easier to just row and rely on perceived effort (AKA RPE = Relative Perceived Effort) and pace.

You only have time for a quick, hard 2k? Then after a warm up have at it, knowing that it's going to be a relatively short workout.

You plan on doing 8k? Pick an appropriate pace and start. If after 1k your heart rate goes through the roof and you're huffing and puffing, slow down to something that will allow you to complete the distance, and next time use the modified pace. Check every now and then during the workout to see what you HR is, compare that to how you feel and go from there.

It won't take long for you to figure out what pace works best for different types of workouts, and as long as you keep pushing yourself a bit as time goes on you'll improve.

Caveat: If you're the type who loves spreadsheets and crunching data, and find that a strict regimen works best for you, then ignore everything I just said above.

Good Luck

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