About Drag Factor...

[AJx]

Hi,

I'm relatively new to rowing (having only started in Jan) and am by far no expert.
Looking through the forums (Training and FAQ) there seems to be a lot of confusion concerning Drag Factor.

In an attempt to answer most queries about DF, here goes..
As I see it, the lower the DF the less air allowed to flow to the fan, therefore less resistance, thus it is easier to push against a lower DF. However, the monitor takes this into account and so 'adjusts' the pace reading accordingly.
Thus even though a higher DF may seem harder (especially for longer periods), to achieve the same pace at the same SPM, takes more effort (particularly on the legs) at a lower DF.
i.e. It is easier to pull a faster pace at higher DF, but easier to move up and down the slide at a lower DF - hence the reason for set rate pieces.

As for what DF one should use, i'm not entirely sure, for me, having a lower (~105 - ~115) for the longer/set rate pieces (SPM 18-22) to develop power/stroke and a higher DF (~115 - ~ 130) for the Interval pieces but maintaining a higher SPM (28-34) is the way i'm training so far.

Anyways thats my twocents, hope it helped

[gregsmith01748]

Hi,
I do exactly what you do, lower for long, higher for short. In my case 120 and about 130-135. When I do WP L4 workouts, I use 115, to stay on plan.

I think that you might want to use Dfs if you are training for a specific on the water purpose. From what I understand, rowing in an eight is a lot more like the erg at a higher drag factor. I wouldn't know though since I am only a dry land rower.

[wjschmidt2]

I have experimented with dfs and found I row my best time trials at 2k and above with a 125 df. In training, I have been using a 116 df for the past few months and have been very happy with the training. I set my best 500m and 1000m time trials using 135 and 130 respectively.

My stroke rate is on the high side: 2kr36, 60'r29-31, but I am also small in height 5'8" which may allow a higher turnover. My training stroke rate for a 60' straight row: 24 to 26 with a pace of 1:56 to 1:58.

Bill

[AJx]

I'm also just a dry ERGer, hoping to enter into some indoor competitions if I can get my 2k quick enough, but I do agree I think DF is more something to consider if your are an OTW rower...

@ Bill, yeah i think height does allow a quicker SPM, but its harder to get as much power in your stroke due to a shorter stroke length, so i'm not entirely sure of the trade off, being only 5'11'' my self i'm not exactly an average height rower either!

[Citroen]

I'm also just a dry ERGer, hoping to enter into some indoor competitions if I can get my 2k quick enough, but I do agree I think DF is more something to consider if your are an OTW rower...

There's much discussion of this both on here and on the UK forum http://concept2.co.uk/forum It definitely isn't just a thing for OTW rowers. Too high a drag and your technique will go badly wrong with too much focus on using your body/arms rather than your legs. There's a good discussion of drag/damper and it's effect at http://grahamlay.blogspot.com/2010/10/i ... guide.html

[hjs]

Hi,

I'm relatively new to rowing (having only started in Jan) and am by far no expert.
Looking through the forums (Training and FAQ) there seems to be a lot of confusion concerning Drag Factor.

In an attempt to answer most queries about DF, here goes..
As I see it, the lower the DF the less air allowed to flow to the fan, therefore less resistance, thus it is easier to push against a lower DF. However, the monitor takes this into account and so 'adjusts' the pace reading accordingly.
Thus even though a higher DF may seem harder (especially for longer periods), to achieve the same pace at the same SPM, takes more effort (particularly on the legs) at a lower DF.
i.e. It is easier to pull a faster pace at higher DF, but easier to move up and down the slide at a lower DF - hence the reason for set rate pieces.

As for what DF one should use, i'm not entirely sure, for me, having a lower (~105 - ~115) for the longer/set rate pieces (SPM 18-22) to develop power/stroke and a higher DF (~115 - ~ 130) for the Interval pieces but maintaining a higher SPM (28-34) is the way i'm training so far.

Anyways thats my twocents, hope it helped

The pm messures the power at the rate the fan slows down. The higher the drag, the more air resistance, the more slowing down.
Using a high drag often goes together with a high spm and "cycle" like stroke, going up and down the rail more or less in a 1 on 1 rate. You see this very often been done in gyms.

Using a lower drag makes the fan slow down less fast, so you can use a lower spm and let the fan run, the stroke itself needs to fast tough, for people who are used to high drag this often feels like pulling "nothing" but it simply what you are used to.

In itself every drag is ok, and strong people can perfectly use a high drag and still use decent technique, but for an average rower and OTW rowers a lower drag is better.

[gregsmith01748]

Hi,

I just saw a very interesting article on drag factor in the Rowing Biomechanics newsletter, linked from the rowing illustrated website.

http://biorow.com/RBN_en_2011_files/201 ... News01.pdf

It talks about drag factors that best simulate different types of boats. Examples:

1x - 127 - 133
8+ - 86 - 95

I totally had it wrong. I thought higher drag factors lined up with bigger boats, but now thinking about it, I guess you have a ton more momentum, which would correlate well with a lower drag factor.

[Nosmo]

Hi,

I just saw a very interesting article on drag factor in the Rowing Biomechanics newsletter, linked from the rowing illustrated website.

http://biorow.com/RBN_en_2011_files/201 ... News01.pdf

It talks about drag factors that best simulate different types of boats. Examples:

1x - 127 - 133
8+ - 86 - 95

I totally had it wrong. I thought higher drag factors lined up with bigger boats, but now thinking about it, I guess you have a ton more momentum, which would correlate well with a lower drag factor.

It is not really the momentum but the speed of the boat and quickness of the catch in bigger boats that lowers the drag factor. The power to resistance ratio that is so much greater in an 8+ then a 1x.
However, when an 8+ is not rowing together then the drag factor can be much higher then in a single. If someone's oar enters the water before the others, then s/he will be trying to accelerate the whole by themselves and the drag will be very high. Also when starting the drag is very high in an 8, unless everyone is completely together.

I've seen this very clearly when rowing a 2x with different rowers. If I call "paddle" someone who does almost all their rowing in 8+ will row at very little pressure. A single sculler will keep the pressure much higher.
(another difference is a single sculler will blame themselves if something is wrong and a sweep rower will usually blame others )

[Bob S.]

(another difference is a single sculler will blame themselves if something is wrong and a sweep rower will usually blame others )

ain't it the truth. and one can probably include the 2X and 4X rowers with the sweepers.

Bob S.

[Tinus]

Hi,

I just saw a very interesting article on drag factor in the Rowing Biomechanics newsletter, linked from the rowing illustrated website.

http://biorow.com/RBN_en_2011_files/201 ... News01.pdf

It talks about drag factors that best simulate different types of boats. Examples:

1x - 127 - 133
8+ - 86 - 95

I totally had it wrong. I thought higher drag factors lined up with bigger boats, but now thinking about it, I guess you have a ton more momentum, which would correlate well with a lower drag factor.

The RBN newsletter matches dragfactor based on handle speed. If you lower the dragfactor then the flywheel rotates faster for the same power input. This results in a higher handle speed for the same power. The newsletter compares handle speed on the erg to handle speed in the boat. (It actually matches hdf. If you are rowing with higher handle force then you should use a higher dragfactor for the same hdf. Heavy weight rowers, rowing fast, who want to mimic 8+ handle speeds should not select a dragfactor between 86 and 95.)

There is a second view on the dragfactor. Like changing the cog size, changing the damper setting has effect on the handle speed. But, it also has an effect on the ratio between acceleration/velocity (dimension = per time). If you decrease the drag factor then you row at much lower relative handle speed variation. You can match dragfactor to boat types based on this parameter and you get a slightly different picture.

1x ~ 131
8+ ~ 30

This is, if you simply use a theoretical comparison matching the hydrodynamical and aerodynamic dragfactors of boat and rowing machine (which can be expressed as acceleration/velocity when absorbing the boat or flywheel inertia). In rowing you also have boat accelerations due to the moving rower mass and hence the acceleration/velocity ratio should be higher in practice. This can not be determined theoretically so there should be some experimental data. Anyway, matching dragfactor to boat types only based on handle velocity is limited. One should also look at handle acceleration.

[Nosmo]

(another difference is a single sculler will blame themselves if something is wrong and a sweep rower will usually blame others )

ain't it the truth. and one can probably include the 2X and 4X rowers with the sweepers.

Bob S.

Most 2x and 4x scullers spend a lot of time in a 1x. At least that is how it is for master rowers in my experience, so it can go either way.

[hjs]

Hi,

I just saw a very interesting article on drag factor in the Rowing Biomechanics newsletter, linked from the rowing illustrated website.

http://biorow.com/RBN_en_2011_files/201 ... News01.pdf

It talks about drag factors that best simulate different types of boats. Examples:

1x - 127 - 133
8+ - 86 - 95

I totally had it wrong. I thought higher drag factors lined up with bigger boats, but now thinking about it, I guess you have a ton more momentum, which would correlate well with a lower drag factor.

The higher the speed of the boat, the faster the water runs under you so the faster you have to stroke, so the lower the drag.