Beginner here!

General discussion on Training. How to get better on your erg, how to use your erg to get better at another sport, or anything else about improving your abilities.
SMOGGY
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Beginner here!

Post by SMOGGY » February 19th, 2018, 7:18 am

Hi all - first post so please be gentle!

I recently bought a concept 2 Model D (last week) to use at home.

I've done a bit on the concept 2 as a part of my overall gym workouts without taking it very seriously. I was using it for a warm up or the occasional 2k. After moving countries and change of job, I've found myself out of shape and needing to get back to exercise - hence buying this for home.

I think my technique is fairly sound and I'm currently doing 2 x 2000 a day, morning and night - although my times are horrible: 9.45

I'm just looking to increase stamina, lose a bit of weight and generally feel a bit better.

What is the best way to progress form this point?

I'm 56, 181, 90kg

Many thanks in advance.

Dangerscouse
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by Dangerscouse » February 19th, 2018, 8:44 am

If you want to increase stamina and lose a bit of weight you will need to increase the distance, 2k will do very little for either. Over time you should try and increase distance to 10km or further.

What is your stroke rate?
45 HWT; 6' 4"; Liverpool 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:27; 6k= 21:23; 10k= 36:21 30mins= 8,356m 60mins= 16,317m HM= 1:18:40; FM= 2:49:39; 50k= 3:28:18; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you Row"

Instagram: stuwenman

mitchel674
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by mitchel674 » February 19th, 2018, 9:00 am

Welcome!

If you feel your technique is "fairly sound", you may want to consider starting an organized workout program like the Beginner Pete Plan.
https://thepeteplan.wordpress.com/beginner-training/

You need to row longer. The plan will gradually ramp up your distance and also contains various interval training sessions. I was just like you 6 months ago and am now starting week #23 of the Pete Plan. It has been very motivating for me. Plus the encouragement and advice found on this site has been excellent.

Get on your new erg and row!
54yo male, 6ft, 162lbs

SMOGGY
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by SMOGGY » February 19th, 2018, 9:21 am

Thanks for the advice!

My SPM is looking like around 32!

mitchel674
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by mitchel674 » February 19th, 2018, 9:53 am

SMOGGY wrote:Thanks for the advice!

My SPM is looking like around 32!
Wow, 32 spm? Who's chasing you? I'm a newbie, but you would benefit from longer, slower rows. Try rowing at 24spm and focus on your technique. Have you ever tried to row strapless (feet not in the straps)? This can be a great way to check your form and control.
54yo male, 6ft, 162lbs

SMOGGY
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by SMOGGY » February 19th, 2018, 9:59 am

I was just reading about slower SPM!

I dunno, 32 seems fairly natural to me but after 10 minutes i feel quite knackered.

mitchel674
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by mitchel674 » February 19th, 2018, 10:32 am

SMOGGY wrote:I was just reading about slower SPM!

I dunno, 32 seems fairly natural to me but after 10 minutes i feel quite knackered.
You simply cannot row at 32spm for very long. That's a pace for a short sprint or an exhaustive time trial. If you are looking to lose weight and increase stamina, you will do both with longer steady state rows at a pace you can maintain for 30 minutes or longer.
54yo male, 6ft, 162lbs

SMOGGY
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by SMOGGY » February 19th, 2018, 10:38 am

Thanks for the reply.

I'm going to start the "peteplan" with a lower SPM :D

Dangerscouse
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Location: Liverpool, England

Re: Beginner here!

Post by Dangerscouse » February 19th, 2018, 11:10 am

If you're rowing at 32spm and at 2:26 pace your technique definitely needs refining. You should be aiming to row at 22-24 for that pace.

You need to concentrate on lengthening your stroke. You're fairly tall so it won't be hard but you're expending too much energy going backwards and forwards without going very fast. As Mitchel said 32spm is unsustainable and is only used for sprinting.

The slower stroke rate will be strange to start with so lower it slowly over a 4-6 weeks or maybe longer. Do you have a smartphone? If you do get the ErgData app and let us know your drive length.
45 HWT; 6' 4"; Liverpool 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:27; 6k= 21:23; 10k= 36:21 30mins= 8,356m 60mins= 16,317m HM= 1:18:40; FM= 2:49:39; 50k= 3:28:18; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you Row"

Instagram: stuwenman

SMOGGY
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by SMOGGY » February 19th, 2018, 11:37 am

Dangerscouse: Got the app. Will try it tonight and report back. what should the drive length be?

I've had the force curve feature turned on - and that looks fairly smooth

gooseflight
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by gooseflight » February 19th, 2018, 12:10 pm

SMOGGY wrote:Thanks for the reply.

I'm going to start the "peteplan" with a lower SPM :D
There's no rush. I would spend a month honing your technique and getting your stroke rate down.

Get to the point of being able to row a continuous 20 minutes (or more) at 20 to 24 spm then think about the plan.

To be a tad blunt, you say your technique is sound but 9:45 splits at 32spm suggest that may not be the case.
Roy Walter
M55 | 185cm | 90kg | Journeyman Erger
PBs (2004): 6:38 (2K) | 5:22.9 (mile) | 17:39.6 (5K) | 8323 (30 mins) | 36:52 (10K) | 1:22:03 (HM '05)

SMOGGY
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Joined: February 19th, 2018, 6:47 am

Re: Beginner here!

Post by SMOGGY » February 19th, 2018, 12:37 pm

Yeah, looking that way. I thought it was sound enough but obviously not.

I think I'll have to start again.

JerekKruger
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by JerekKruger » February 19th, 2018, 12:56 pm

First off welcome, and good choice buying yourself a Concept 2.

As Stu and Mitchel say, a rate of 32 and a pace of 2:26 suggests there's work to be done on your stroke. Assuming your sequencing is right (which is what I assume you mean by your technique being sound) there are two things you should try to do. First, slow your rate down: Stu's suggestion of 22-24 is a good one, though given the difference that might feel uncomfortable so reduce it in steps if you have to. At the same time try to make the drive portion of your stroke more powerful: push harder with your legs and finish off the stroke strong. When you combine these two you should find that, despite rating lower, your split is not much slower (it might even be faster). After this it's simply a matter of building up how far/long you can go in a session and, over time, how fast.

I also agree with gooseflight by the way: I'd say spend a little while working up to being able to row 20 minutes (or even better, 30) continuously at lower stroke rates three times per week before you jump onto the BPP.
Tom | 33 | 6'6" | 93kg

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JerekKruger
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Re: Beginner here!

Post by JerekKruger » February 19th, 2018, 1:06 pm

SMOGGY wrote:Yeah, looking that way. I thought it was sound enough but obviously not.
You've probably got the sequencing right i.e. you drive with your legs, then your back, then pull with your arms (and do the reverse in the recovery). That's already a good thing as many people never learn to do that. What takes some getting used to with rowing is the big difference in duration between the drive and the recovery. For longer rows a ration of 1:2 is fairly normal i.e. if your drive takes 1s then your recovery would take 2s (I actually get closer to 1:3). Have a watch of Concept2's technique video and notice how relatively longer and relaxed the recovery is.
Tom | 33 | 6'6" | 93kg

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Dangerscouse
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Location: Liverpool, England

Re: Beginner here!

Post by Dangerscouse » February 19th, 2018, 1:18 pm

SMOGGY wrote:Yeah, looking that way. I thought it was sound enough but obviously not.

I think I'll have to start again.
It's better to retrain your technique now as the longer you get used to it the easier it is to fall back into it when you get tired and aren't concentrating as much. Get the foundations right and you'll reap the benefits a lot quicker.

I'm not sure on drive length for other people but I range between 1:39 - 1:59. As I'm a bit taller than you I assume yours may be less, as an ideal range, but not much less as I don't lean back much but I'm not sure how much of a difference the power in each stroke influences that number.

It will also be useful for you to comment on wattage for your 2k. This will show how powerful your stroke is.
45 HWT; 6' 4"; Liverpool 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:27; 6k= 21:23; 10k= 36:21 30mins= 8,356m 60mins= 16,317m HM= 1:18:40; FM= 2:49:39; 50k= 3:28:18; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you Row"

Instagram: stuwenman

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