Form feedback - especially in longer sessions

[PleaseLockIn]

I often felt as if I could hold form well for the first parts of steady state and then start deteriorating especially after a 50 minute sessions. How can I hold form better? The wrists are slightly bent at the stroke, various strokes I tried to not use my back earlier and I used it when my legs are around 130 degrees…

The recovery is clearly somewhat weird tho

https://youtu.be/6OgAo3yRNp0?si=EcMSNx9eLZ5zPnDe For context please help my technique

[Dangerscouse]

I'm not sure that form is the issue here, as I suspect that base fitness is. FWIW, I almost always notice a change in effort at around 45 mins, to varying degrees, which I believe is due to a change in energy systems and burning more fat stores.

If your technique is good and eventually deteriorates then you'll probably benefit from breaking up the longer distances into intervals, assuming that you don't do that already, and then slowly increase the distance / time as you get more comfortable with the effort.

[HornetMaX]

Sorry for the small off-topic (I let more qualified rowers help you about the form).

FWIW, I almost always notice a change in effort at around 45 mins, to varying degrees, which I believe is due to a change in energy systems and burning more fat stores.

Same here. At the 50-60min mark, I feel something change and I'd say I've even witnessed my HR go down a bit (for the same pace).

[iain]

I think it was Mike C that suggested that the change above was due to tiring of the slow twitch muscles so that the fast twitch is used more often than is comfortable. Doesn't explain an HR decline 'though. I noticed a significant HR decline when I hit the wall, so maybe this does happen with increased fat metabolism. Makes no sense as you actually need to use more oxygen to produce the same energy from fat as carbs, but it definitely happened!

[p_b82]

No expert, the only tiny thing I picked up, is that you appear to pull/flick your head backwards at the start of the drive a bit, no idea if it affects form, but you might find it a little more comfortable to keep your head in a more neutral position.

My conclusion is that it appears to me that you're tensing up in the moment; almost as if you're "readying yourself for the big effort" rather than the effort just being a fluid thing.

It might be a factor in your fatigue if you are tensing everything up every stroke though maybe?

What part of the form do you find is suffering?
posture, sequencing?

Is it a lack of power generation - which part of the stroke is suffering - how does your force curve change? etc.

If you're going at FM pace (I expect it is a bit slower than your typical SS pace) / something you could maintain for 2+hrs - do you get the same issues?

If no then it does point it towards it being endurance / muscle fatigue not form imo.

[PleaseLockIn]

No expert, the only tiny thing I picked up, is that you appear to pull/flick your head backwards at the start of the drive a bit, no idea if it affects form, but you might find it a little more comfortable to keep your head in a more neutral position.

My conclusion is that it appears to me that you're tensing up in the moment; almost as if you're "readying yourself for the big effort" rather than the effort just being a fluid thing.

It might be a factor in your fatigue if you are tensing everything up every stroke though maybe?

What part of the form do you find is suffering?
posture, sequencing?

Is it a lack of power generation - which part of the stroke is suffering - how does your force curve change? etc.

If you're going at FM pace (I expect it is a bit slower than your typical SS pace) / something you could maintain for 2+hrs - do you get the same issues?

If no then it does point it towards it being endurance / muscle fatigue not form imo.

In the video I tried to keep shoulders stable but ended up prematurely pulling back in all the strokes. I actually overcompressed slightly so perhaps I am tensing up too much. I don’t have too good a connection too.

I did tense up a bit as I thought the rowing stroke should start explosively. I tense up a lot of strokes, though less at the start.

I find connection, posture suffers somewhat. The sequencing begins to overlap more and sometimes I engage the back without legs almost fully extended. I tried to pronate my scapula 1” and at start hold it then when engaging back pull back a bit. After that pull more. But it failed.

Force curve - not smooth, more similar to exponential curve at the end than the ideal curve various times especially at the end. The flick head backwards does get uncomfortable 50+ mins in. And sometimes in intervals - especially when I need to push max.

Sometimes the cycling motion from catch to recovery is a bit weird - the shoulder movement probably has something to do with it.

The recover began overlapping - back going at same time as legs. I think in this video in some strokes you could see it subtly.

At FM pace - still there, though less.

[p_b82]

No coach - but I honestly think you're massively overthinking this and trying "too hard"

Just relax a bit and stop trying to use "the perfect stroke" - if you open your back a bit early, so what - as long as it's not a huge overlap etc.

I know I mentioned this before, but a relaxed stroke is a consistent stroke - one you are able to repeat with minimal deviations stroke to stroke in terms of rating and pacing.
Find that relaxed stroke - then work on the power/pace/form tweaking.

You'll never manage to row at your best if you're tensing up - esp on the longer stuff.

[Dangerscouse]

I did tense up a bit as I thought the rowing stroke should start explosively. I tense up a lot of strokes, though less at the start.

Yep, I agree with Peter.

It does take time and effort to perfect technique, as you inadvertently ingrain mistakes that become part of muscle memory, so just keep interrogating what you're doing at different stages of a row.

You do need to be tense, but you also need to relax. It's almost like a 80-85% tension, otherwise it's just wasted energy, at least it is imo.

[p_b82]

I'd not say tense - but I would say a strong position.

One needs to be able to resist the forces being applied but not by consciously making the effort on every drive.

I see it as the difference of just picking something up without thought, and the "extra" one gives an item when they know it's heavy to break the inertia.

I may well be wrong, but that's just how I see it, and how I interpret watching just how effortless the elite rowers make generating serious power look. (relaxed, fluid, smooth etc).