Model c with pm2

[Formerhondaman]

Hello all.

This really is an introduction as I have sifted through a few posts and found some useful posts.

I'm 47, 14st. 3 lbs
Resting pulse 50-55
Bp ranges from healthy to take medication ( there is not explanation for the higher reading which at times reach 150/100)
I bought a model c with a pm 2 its is quite a tired machine buts works. The monitor is fine for real time figures but the preset time is stuck on 5k for distance which turns out to be handy for 5k test but the time is stuck on 16mins which is no use to anything.
I started rowing about April 2020, so 8 months.
I do an eclectic mix of rowing workouts, usually 3 -6 times a week it does depend on time, definately Saturday and Sunday and what ever I can fit in the week around life.
Workouts ranging from 20-25 up to 45 mins on rare occasions. From straight 5 k to 1 min on 3 off for 25 mins or to start at 18bpm for 4 mins 20 spm for 3 mins 22 spm for 2 mins 24 spm for 1 min then in reverse with 1 min rest between and workouts that are randomly in between all off the above. You get the picture.
Best 5k is 19 min 26sec at sr of about 23,24 damper on 6.
I have recently started doing steady state row at 2.15 sr 20 with nose breathing only and holding breath for one full stroke every 10 strokes to try and improve co2 feedback. I.e. become more efficient with less.
After every session be it 3 times a week or 6 times I try to do 10 mins of moving some dumbells and a kettle bell about to try and stave off old age and to keep the wife interested, old age is easier to deal with lol.
As I'm not a rower and have taught myself rowing, mostly through YouTube, dark horse rowing are there any tips to help lower Hr further a d reduce BP or at least stabilise it that or does the above cover what I should be doing.
Thanks in advance
Rob

[robbiep]

I've no idea what on earth 'Co2 feedback' is - it's not something that I've ever seen recommended, or that is used by elite rowers.

You're making it too complicated, keep it simple !

[Formerhondaman]

The co2 feed back is basically the bodies way of sensing when it thinks you need to breathe and this can be altered with a rudimentary understanding of the Bohr effect. I.e. the efficiency at which your body distributes and releases and uses oxygen based on the co2 levels in the body. If you hold your breath the urge to breath is the co2 feedback.
This breath urge can be shifted within set parameters to make the body more efficient. In essence it does this by raising the tolerance at which you feel you need to breath which raises the co2 level making oxygen use more efficient, lowering heart rate plus a whole load of other benefits including increase in vo2max. Good starting place for more detail is the oxygen advantage by Patrick mckeown. Bohr effect basics on Wikipedia is also quite good. I can assure you that elite and professional athletes use this feed back to improve performance, a quick Internet search will bring up a host of olympians and sports people from ufc champions to ultradistance runners and gold medal olympians that do and have used it. .
Anyhow I do not know about rowing which is why I am here so I will take on board your suggestion of keeping it simple.
I'll look to simply training for the improvements im looking for. A nudge in the right direction would be helpful as I said I know nothing about rowing really other than I enjoy it of course. Maybe you could expand a little on keep it simple please.

Thanks Rob

[Ombrax]

Rob,

Welcome to the forum. : )

When you say that the PM is "stuck" on specific times and distances for the workouts, what exactly does that mean? I've never heard of that problem.

However, if the PM really is all messed up, as I'm sure you've already realized, you could upgrade to a PM5. That would allow you to access a much wider world of rowing-related data, and given your interests in tweaking performance that may be of interest. (However, I will suggest that I bet that for a relative newbie there are much greater gains to be made using the more "traditional" improvement tools, such as refining your rowing technique and "plans" like the BPP, PP, and Wolverine plan.)

Good luck, it sounds like you're well on your way on an interesting rowing journey.

[MPx]

[edit: apologies, Ombrax already posted the most useful stuff here.]

I moved on for the PM2 (to a PM2+ !) in the late '90s and I cant remember anything about it other than it didn't connect to anything else. If you're in this for the long haul I'd recommend saving up for a later PM so that you can link it to a laptop (either by cable or via a phone/ergdata) and keep a record of your sessions in a C2 log. Its useful and motivational to see how you do on the various pieces over time.

Equipment aside, if you're determined you can still get fitter with a functional erg regardless of data and feedback. Your sub 20min 5k and 50-55 RHR suggest you already have a reasonable level of fitness. You don't mention how tall you are - a significant omission as greater height has some advantage in rowing, and would qualify whether 14st 3lb was overweight, average or lean. Your goals also will have a decisive factor of what's best for you.

For most of us, we need to work harder to build and/or maintain an aerobic base which is the dominant influence on performance on the erg over 4 minutes if not less. If you only want to work on sprint performance then strength can be a greater factor. Assuming that you want general fitness and performance for 2k and more then its often recommended on here that 80% of your time should be spent on steady stated rows of 30 mins or more with HR at around 70% of max. That 70% has many definitions and can be hard to test for, so some find it easier to think in terms of exercising at a level that you can still maintain a conversation - which inherently seems rather too slow! The other 20% should be spent doing hard sessions typically intervals of various types.

If you've only got time for three sessions a week then I'd recommend 1 or 2 long steady, 0 or 1 long interval, and 1 sprint interval. Any extra sessions should be long steady. You mention a number of sessions that you already do which shows good variety. IMO its worth writing down your plan so that you know what you're going to do each time and don't sub-consciously let your favourites dominate. Many do a few cycles of one of the Pete Plans (Beginner, 2k or 5k). They can be brutal to try to stick to forever, but they teach you quite a lot about training and can be a useful source of session ideas. There are many other plans Wolverine; Interactive; etc which all have their advocates. Just do a search on here to get more background and links.

Enjoy

[Formerhondaman]

Thank you for all the replies.

To answer the points raised.

I am 6f1 tall so it appears from what you say I may have some advantage over more vertically challenges people.
The pm 2 monitor I have has a preset for time or distance i.e you set them and go for that prescribed distance or time both of which cannot be changed from either 16mins or 5 k they are stuck at those values. But the other monitor functions appear to work. It displays current data including the data you can cycle through, I hope that makes sense.
I will when finances allow trade up for a model d with pm 5 but need to sell house first. Oh and convince my wife its a good investment???? Believe this will offer more than I need. I dont currently train with heart rate monitor but can confirm it beats faster when I row.
My aim is to generally gain better overall fitness, I'd like a resting heart rate to be sub 50 and normal or low BP. Im particularly interested in 5k time and maybe work up to doing a pb on 10k. I currently stop at 8k ish on the stuff I'm doing. For me, balls out for sweat fest for about 30 mins ish is enjoyable. Sprints are not my thing really so more interested in 500m average over medium distances. I would not be much faster at 500 sprint than my average 500 for 5-8k . Seems like its alot of effort for me but not much by way of time improvement. Maybe I'll revisit once I'm more structured,?
Rowing for me is about getting fitter as i age and being the best I can be and aim for Improvement on my achievements. I'm not sure at what age you stop trying to be better or faster, for me at 47 its not yet. I'm not sure its relevant but I am strict vegan in my quest for healthier life to?
I will look at training suggestions thanks for those.
Thanks again for all suggestions, I'll keep you posted on my progress

[CeeGee]

I will when finances allow trade up for a model d with pm 5 but need to sell house first.

No need for this, you can just (I believe) retrofit a PM5 monitor. A fraction of the cost of a new rower!

Someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

[Ombrax]

No need for this, you can just (I believe) retrofit a PM5 monitor. A fraction of the cost of a new rower!

CG is correct - a PM5 can be retrofitted onto a Model C. You may also decide to change the support arm, depending on how much filing & sanding you want to do to mount the newer PM onto the C - it isn't a 100% drop-in replacement (but it isn't that hard either). Given the relatively low price of a new arm I chose to go that route.

[Formerhondaman]

Appreciate further advice. The intention is to get a model d with pm 5 and sell this one in a couple of months or so. Rather than upgrade it. The sLe will off set the cost a nearly new by some margin.