Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

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hjs
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by hjs » April 29th, 2016, 4:33 am

remisture wrote:Is HM+5 secs really doable, or was that just an example? Because for me, that sounds impossible :shock: I was actually thinking going for HM+9-10 next time, which puts me around 1:59-2:00 pace.
Very doable, even hm plus 3 for some. WR is 141/42 ish. Dave williams age 48 pulls 1.45 on the fm, with a 6.14 2k A base. You simply need to be very aerobicly trained and ofcourse have the talent.

If you pull 1.59 ish, I would be very little impressed, don,t get me wrong, but really thats very doable for a 6.30 erger.

Bloodbuzz Corio
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by Bloodbuzz Corio » April 29th, 2016, 4:46 am

Remi,

I've seen a couple of estimates of FM pace - though neither based on HM pace - and not necessarily applicable to someone with your relative strengths.

http://indoorsportservices.co.uk/traini ... thon_intro says to take the difference between 5k pace and 10k pace, add that to your 10k pace to get your HM pace and add double it to get your FM pace.

Excuse me if my maths are wrong but looking at your signature you appear to have a pace of:
  • 1:42.6 for 5k
  • 1:48.6 for 10k
  • 1:50.4 for HM
So you've already proved that link may not apply to you by having a much smaller gap between 10k and HM pace than between 5k and 10k pace (but if you did apply their formula you'd be looking at 2:00.6 - about what you've suggested)

The downloadable guide at http://indoorsportservices.co.uk/training/marathon says '60-70% of 2000 m power in watts – closer to 65% or slightly below for the majority' and 65% based on your 2k pace would be a fairly brisk 1:52.4!

Applying the first of those approaches to my times would give an HM pace of 2:03.7 and a FM pace of 2:07.8 (scary!), and the second an HM pace of 2:08.7 (still scary!). Having said that, the first link is also based on a 24 week training program of either 80k or 110k a week - way way more than I currently do. Certainly expect my first FM to be in the '42,195 across a few intervals' type. :D
Rohan - 46y, 178cm, ~77kg, Logbook

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hjs
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by hjs » April 29th, 2016, 7:10 am

If you pull your times on only 30k a week you are doing great. A fm on those meters will proberbly be a tough task. You could simply try a longer session per week, just by feel and see how you get along.
You need a cook place and you need to be anle to sit long enough. Glutes ate not seldom the weak link during long work.

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jackarabit
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by jackarabit » April 29th, 2016, 9:42 am

Here's a direct link to the ISS UK HM and FM predictor from 5k pace:

http://indoorsportservices.co.uk/traini ... athon_pace
There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

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Bloodbuzz Corio
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by Bloodbuzz Corio » April 29th, 2016, 11:15 am

There's also the Free Spirits pace predictor which gives you predictions across all distances from any pair of PBs

http://www.freespiritsrowing.com/conten ... predictor/
Rohan - 46y, 178cm, ~77kg, Logbook

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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by b12bandit » April 29th, 2016, 3:53 pm

I've done several FM's (a long time ago!). Super slow and steady. Never really tried to push it. PB was around 3hrs 15min.
Also did a 50k, with breaks at 20 and 40. That was hard. As several have already pointed out, it's difficult not to go off too fast, and the last hour is a killer. More mentally than physically. Just grinding out the kms is as much a test of will power as muscle power.
After a long break from rowing and the gym, I'm trying to get back in the groove with some distance work - I was always more tortoise than hare.
Good luck with your FM attempt. Don't rush it.

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Carl Watts
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by Carl Watts » April 29th, 2016, 10:45 pm

I think you need to remember the FM is a totally different animal to complete. You could even have a very fast 2K and you will still not get there to the finish line. You experience all sorts of issues that simply don't come up in the shorter events from dehydration to cramps, sore backside the list goes on. A FM runner doesn't look anything like a 100M sprinter and there is a reason for that, it takes something different to complete a FM. Basically you have no idea how hard one of these is until you try it. You need to be able to bash out a series HM with no effort to the point when you finish you feel like you could do another one straight away, thats about as close to being "Ready" as your going to get. Don't underestimate how hard it is to get even a half way decent time. I had the WORST immediate both legs fully cramped after the finish as soon as my feet came out and touched the ground, it was agony. As others have mentioned the last hour is the one you need to be mentally prepared for you need to be able to continue to row through PAIN.
Carl Watts.
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lindsayh
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by lindsayh » April 30th, 2016, 1:31 am

hjs wrote:Very doable, even hm plus 3 for some. WR is 141/42 ish. Dave williams age 48 pulls 1.45 on the fm, with a 6.14 2k A base. You simply need to be very aerobicly trained and ofcourse have the talent.
If you pull 1.59 ish, I would be very little impressed, don,t get me wrong, but really thats very doable for a 6.30 erger.
FWIW Dave has a 1:12.55 HM and a 2:28 FM this season which I think is about 1:42 and 1:45 pace
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PBs (65y+) 1 min 349m, 500m 1:29.8, 1k 3:11.7 2k 6:47.4, 5km 18:07.9, 30' 7928m, 10k 37:57.2, 60' 15368m

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hjs
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by hjs » April 30th, 2016, 4:01 am

Carl Watts wrote:I think you need to remember the FM is a totally different animal to complete. You could even have a very fast 2K and you will still not get there to the finish line. You experience all sorts of issues that simply don't come up in the shorter events from dehydration to cramps, sore backside the list goes on. A FM runner doesn't look anything like a 100M sprinter and there is a reason for that, it takes something different to complete a FM. Basically you have no idea how hard one of these is until you try it. You need to be able to bash out a series HM with no effort to the point when you finish you feel like you could do another one straight away, thats about as close to being "Ready" as your going to get. Don't underestimate how hard it is to get even a half way decent time. I had the WORST immediate both legs fully cramped after the finish as soon as my feet came out and touched the ground, it was agony. As others have mentioned the last hour is the one you need to be mentally prepared for you need to be able to continue to row through PAIN.
100 meter versus 2k? 10 seconds versus 6/7 min, very strange and wrong comparison. Every serious erging can row a fm, because he does a lot of aerobic training. A 100 meter runner does zero and will never ever run a marathon.

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hjs
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by hjs » April 30th, 2016, 11:11 am

remisture wrote:I know a couple of guys that pull 6:15-25 WITHOUT any distance work at all (just crossfit), but i really doubt they could do a FM with sub 2:00 splits, so I dont think 2k times are good measurements for FM.
Not directly no, but crossfitters do a lot of stuff, not just short, so they do endurance work.

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Carl Watts
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by Carl Watts » April 30th, 2016, 6:14 pm

remisture wrote:I know a couple of guys that pull 6:15-25 WITHOUT any distance work at all (just crossfit), but i really doubt they could do a FM with sub 2:00 splits, so I dont think 2k times are good measurements for FM.
You are correct. For me the pace predictor said I could have gone quite a bit faster but the reality is no chance. Was lucky to finish in Sub 3 hours. Just not built like an endurance athlete, the shorter distances suit me better. Without a lot of seat time and some HM training they probably wouldn't finish.
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by Ponte.red » May 2nd, 2016, 10:41 am

DONE not I much of a hurry to do it again 3:12:29, reasonably happy,

Had to stand about 4 times, cos my back side was killing me. But managed to do the last 4km in under 16mins so I guess I had some more in the tank... Either way I'm pleased to have done it.

Thanks for all your advise
Know as Dougie, Or Trigger to others.
35----- 202lbs (91kgs) 5' 10"

2k 6:53.5
5k 17:51.6
10k 37:36.8
HM 1:27:57
FM 3:12:29
1h- 15,550

Bloodbuzz Corio
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by Bloodbuzz Corio » May 2nd, 2016, 10:57 am

Great work Trigger! Congratulations.
Rohan - 46y, 178cm, ~77kg, Logbook

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jackarabit
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by jackarabit » May 3rd, 2016, 2:55 pm

Very nice time, Trigger! The seatbone ache problem will improve with time in the saddle.
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Realistic
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Re: Marathon?? Anyone attempting it.

Post by Realistic » April 16th, 2017, 6:15 pm

I just started rowing about a month ago after taking a year off (never been hardcore rower), and noticed the article for the marathon event. Sounds like something I would like to do once, but I won't really be in shape to do it this year. I might try to do the half marathon, but even that is a stretch for me. I recently finished a 10k in 46min, and I thought that was pretty dang good :D

It seems crazy to me how fast people can row, and over such long distances. Even though I don't rank higher than 20% in any rowing distance I still enjoy these challenges, and seeing the progress over time.

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