Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Discuss all things related to the BikeErg, Concept2's newest product.
colagirl
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Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by colagirl » January 13th, 2019, 10:27 am

Just a warning for anyone into HIIT and thinking of buying the erg.
I have a bikeerg at the gym and was thinking of what place it has in my routine workout.

I am not into 1 hour steady state workouts, I do short bursts of hiit for about 20 minutes.

The concept2 rep said "it's not our problem, we don't market the bikeerg as HIIT equipment for HIIT we recommend the echo bike".

When you stand up and pedal flat out for hiit the damper shifts and goes to easy setting making it useless for hiit.

If you are a light and small person or child this might not be a problem I dont know.

So I can't recommend the bikeerg for HIIT, but rather steady state cardio, for HIIT I recommend a dual action bike like schwinn AD6 or the wattbike where the damper actually stays in place.

sophie x

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johnlvs2run
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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by johnlvs2run » January 13th, 2019, 12:10 pm

colagirl wrote:
January 13th, 2019, 10:27 am
The concept2 rep said "it's not our problem, we don't market the bikeerg as HIIT equipment."
When you stand up and pedal flat out for hiit the damper shifts and goes to easy setting making it useless
That's very strange and not good. My $75 bike trainer works great when standing.
73 5'8 155
age 70+ world record pace per weight percentages
skierg: 100m 87.4 / 500m 86.2 / 1k 85.9 / 2k 88.2 / 5k 87.6 / 10k 89.4 / 60' 92.0 / 21k 93.6
my training log

Slothful1
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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by Slothful1 » January 13th, 2019, 3:45 pm

That sounds like it might be a flaw with that specific BikeErg. I haven't noticed my BikeErg's damper lever moving around even when doing high wattage bursts. In the past there were problems on some older rowing ergs with the damper lever sliding down with gravity, but that was after years of use.

I assume there is a way to tighten the damper lever, so it could be worth getting the gym to look into arranging that.

Dave

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by clerkp » January 13th, 2019, 3:49 pm

I've had my bikerg for about a year. For the first time yesterday I tried zwift and I raised the damper and tried some standing up and my power dropped low and I noticed that the resistance did not really really increase. It's not a huge deal for me since I am more of a steady state person but I was surprised. I've reading conflicting reports in here about a flat spot at the bottom when standing up and I noticed that but this seems different. Is there any proof the damper somehow goes into an "easy" mode when standing up? I don't even understand how they could engineer that. Good topic. Interested in responses.

Edit my.damper did not physically drop but my power did.

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by clerkp » January 13th, 2019, 3:52 pm

Colagirl, if your damper physically shifts lower I think that's an issue with the bike. Mine does not do that.

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by Slothful1 » January 13th, 2019, 4:05 pm

I've also noticed that the BikeErg feels different when standing up and pedalling hard, compared with a bike on the road. I assume it is because the BikeErg is using air resistance, so when you are applying maximum power in the downstroke, the fan is "slipping" through the air more easily than the rolling resistance of a bike tyre on tar.

I've managed to live with it though seeing I'm using the BikeErg for cross-training, rather than for improving my real-world bike fitness, so realism doesn't matter too much for me.

Dave

colagirl
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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by colagirl » January 13th, 2019, 10:18 pm

I also know of other people having problems when doing HIIT, some report the belt "slipping" when doing power bursts.

sophie x

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by chipman » January 14th, 2019, 2:50 pm

The guys on the Bikeerg Facebook group don't seem to have any trouble with slipping belts or standing even when they are doing max resistance.

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by chipman » January 14th, 2019, 2:52 pm

Joining this site and then recommending a competiters product on the same day is kind of curious to say the least.

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johnlvs2run
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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by johnlvs2run » January 14th, 2019, 4:13 pm

clerkp wrote:
January 13th, 2019, 3:49 pm
I've had my bikerg for about a year. For the first time yesterday I tried zwift and I raised the damper and tried some standing up and my power dropped low and I noticed that the resistance did not really really increase. It's not a huge deal for me since I am more of a steady state person but I was surprised. I've reading conflicting reports in here about a flat spot at the bottom when standing up and I noticed that but this seems different. Is there any proof the damper somehow goes into an "easy" mode when standing up? I don't even understand how they could engineer that. Good topic. Interested in responses.

Edit my.damper did not physically drop but my power did.
Have you tried putting the damper to max?
Slothful1 wrote:
January 13th, 2019, 4:05 pm
I've also noticed that the BikeErg feels different when standing up and pedalling hard, compared with a bike on the road. I assume it is because the BikeErg is using air resistance, so when you are applying maximum power in the downstroke, the fan is "slipping" through the air more easily than the rolling resistance of a bike tyre on tar.
Could the issue be due to lower RPM when standing? If so, does a maximum drag factor make any difference?
colagirl wrote:
January 13th, 2019, 10:18 pm
I also know of other people having problems when doing HIIT, some report the belt "slipping" when doing power bursts.

sophie x
This is an interesting topic, so perhaps you could invite them to post on here too.
73 5'8 155
age 70+ world record pace per weight percentages
skierg: 100m 87.4 / 500m 86.2 / 1k 85.9 / 2k 88.2 / 5k 87.6 / 10k 89.4 / 60' 92.0 / 21k 93.6
my training log

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by Slothful1 » January 14th, 2019, 4:33 pm

johnlvs2run wrote:
January 14th, 2019, 4:13 pm
Slothful1 wrote:
January 13th, 2019, 4:05 pm
I've also noticed that the BikeErg feels different when standing up and pedalling hard, compared with a bike on the road. I assume it is because the BikeErg is using air resistance, so when you are applying maximum power in the downstroke, the fan is "slipping" through the air more easily than the rolling resistance of a bike tyre on tar.
Could the issue be due to lower RPM when standing? If so, does a maximum drag factor make any difference?
I haven't tried too many variations, but increasing to max drag factor does help pedalling out of the saddle feel closer to that of a road bike when going uphill. It's still not an exact replication, although maybe it does feel similar to a mountain bike on a dirt hill if the wheel loses grip slightly on the pedal down stroke.

In any event I was mainly interested in some alternatives to the rower for the UT2 / UT1 type training days, and wasn't looking for something for power intervals, which is what the OP was looking for.

Dave

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by jamesg » January 15th, 2019, 11:57 am

Pumps and fans have a quadratic torque characteristic, torque increasing with the square of fan speed, and power with the cube. 10% faster then needs 33% more power; 10% slower 27% less. This means the useful speed range will be narrow, so drag has to be just right, especially near max power as in HIIT.

On restart as in HIIT bursts, the load at first will be inertial (flywheel acceleration) so the feel will depend on the gearing.
78y, 188cm, 87kg, MHR 155. Last 2k (24 May 19) 8.46.6@22

CaseyClarke
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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by CaseyClarke » January 16th, 2019, 11:43 am

The 'Bikeerg no good for HIIT' title here is total nonsense. Probably something put up by a rival bike firm to discredit the BE. I regularly do sets of short sprints on my home BE without any issues and it is a top notch workout. If the damper is genuinely slipping back to 1 from 10 (never heard of this issue before now) then it's an issue with that particular BE and you need to call C2.

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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by johnlvs2run » January 16th, 2019, 12:36 pm

CaseyClarke wrote:
January 16th, 2019, 11:43 am
I regularly do sets of short sprints on my home BE without any issues
The issue appears to be about standing sprints, or standing in general on the Bikeerg - not sprinting while sitting.
I am personally interested in this issue when considering a Bikeerg, and appreciate having an open minded discussion.
clerkp wrote:
January 13th, 2019, 3:49 pm
I raised the damper and tried some standing up and my power dropped low and I noticed that the resistance did not really really increase.
Slothful1 wrote:
January 13th, 2019, 4:05 pm
I've also noticed that the BikeErg feels different when standing up and pedalling hard, compared with a bike on the road.
Comments above are by regular forum members. There are similar comments on Slowtwitch by competing triathletes.
73 5'8 155
age 70+ world record pace per weight percentages
skierg: 100m 87.4 / 500m 86.2 / 1k 85.9 / 2k 88.2 / 5k 87.6 / 10k 89.4 / 60' 92.0 / 21k 93.6
my training log

CaseyClarke
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Re: Bikeerg no good for HIIT

Post by CaseyClarke » January 16th, 2019, 12:41 pm

I stand for all my sprint sessions. And stand for sections of longer steady state rides when I need some butt relief. Never noticed any issues on any damper settings. I've used several different BE's. Never noticed any issues on those either. Never heard of this issue mentioned in the Facebook group. Perhaps there are a small batch of dodgy BE's that don't respond as they should when you're standing?!

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