Childish behavier.

From the CRASH-B's to an online challenge, discuss the competitive side of erging here.
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hjs
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Childish behavier.

Post by hjs » February 5th, 2020, 10:04 am

C2 please remove this man from the rankings.

https://log.concept2.com/profile/863525

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Citroen
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by Citroen » February 5th, 2020, 12:01 pm

hjs wrote:
February 5th, 2020, 10:04 am
C2 please remove this man from the rankings.

https://log.concept2.com/profile/863525
Why? He appears to be our favourite New Zealander.
If you have problem report the ID to rowing@concept2.com

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jackarabit
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by jackarabit » February 5th, 2020, 12:27 pm

Henry, we’re past midyear in the rankings season. Carl’s number for 50-59 mhwt 2000m is certainly going to get the attention it merits! Not much clumping up between 6:00 and 6:11. As to the manifesto in the profile gimmick, we all know how well that worked for Ranger. Guess a guy has a right to climb up on a cross and drive the nails himself!! The 9k in 30’ looks to me to be on the edge of possible for Carl as he’s specialized in the Wednesday nite Rowpro 30’ for yrs.
There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

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hjs
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by hjs » February 5th, 2020, 1:45 pm

jackarabit wrote:
February 5th, 2020, 12:27 pm
Henry, we’re past midyear in the rankings season. Carl’s number for 50-59 mhwt 2000m is certainly going to get the attention it merits! Not much clumping up between 6:00 and 6:11. As to the manifesto in the profile gimmick, we all know how well that worked for Ranger. Guess a guy has a right to climb up on a cross and drive the nails himself!! The 9k in 30’ looks to me to be on the edge of possible for Carl as he’s specialized in the Wednesday nite Rowpro 30’ for yrs.
Lots of people use the Rankings as a benchmark, ofcourse he can mess that up anyway he want but his stupid “only my way is the right way” gets very old.

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Anth_F
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by Anth_F » February 5th, 2020, 2:31 pm

Sum gr8 accomplishmentz carl.

REESPEKT
42yo male 5'10 78kg (Rowing since june 9th 2016) PB's 5k 19:22 30min 7518m

My goals are simply to keep fit/get fitter and continue to enjoy rowing on the C2 :)

https://log.concept2.com/profile/1261966

nates
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by nates » February 5th, 2020, 4:25 pm

I'm not sure what the fuss is over, but since you bring it up how about this 2k time (forget watts - it's 9.2 HP)
9

1 Sean Hensley 46 Peninsula, OH USA 2:31.0 No

Nomath
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by Nomath » February 5th, 2020, 4:39 pm

CW has argued his opinion that non-verified ranked times and distances are prone to faking several times on this forum. It is a fair case, but you don't have to agree. No reason to remove him from the rankings and no childish behaviour either, imo.

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Carl Watts
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by Carl Watts » February 5th, 2020, 10:13 pm

Don't waste your time posting here, e-mail Concept 2 and get the Challenges sorted.

In case you have not noticed, the rows are verified so who's to argue they never happened ? Seems its okay to do a Challenge and claim your rowing hundreds of Km's a day without proving you rowed a single meter but yet here we are.

I could also use a pile of PED's and potentially do the same and yet somehow that is not cheating either.

I did this to attract attention to a problem that is easily solved that I'm sick of discussing to have fixed, seems its working.

The Challenges are not about speed anyway, they are about just total meters so why are you worried ? Yeah it pisses you off to have someone above you doesn't it ? try slogging you guts out for 30 days straight without a break on a Challenge and then have dozens of people beat you who cannot prove they have rowed a single meter.

How did I do it ? I'm not telling anyone the secret is safe and yes it still did still involve me actually rowing and its highly unlikely that anyone else in the world can replicate it.

Let me be 1000% crystal clear about this, I would be a total idiot to tell the world how I did it as it will totally stuff up the very verification system I'm trying to get fixed.

Fix the Challenges, its simple and the "Problem" goes away in time for next season.
Carl Watts.
Age:53 Weight: 104kg Height:183cm
Concept 2 Monitor Service Technician & indoor rower.
http://log.concept2.com/profile/863525/log

nates
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by nates » February 5th, 2020, 11:06 pm

What the heck does "verified" actually mean? I mean I have rows which are "verified" that I did with just me, ergdata, and a phone in a gym with no witnesses.

My sole "ranked" 1-min row is marked as unverified but it was done in the exact same way. (Woohoo! I actually came in faster than 420 others. In your face, people actually slower than me!)

I'm not in any challenges, but I log my Forrest Gump rower at home (only counts strokes, and I have a HR watch) at a 3:00 pace for now. Once I get data showing an improvement I'll log at that pace. But it's not really fair to count manually entered stuff in rankings

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hjs
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by hjs » February 6th, 2020, 4:30 am

Nomath wrote:
February 5th, 2020, 4:39 pm
CW has argued his opinion that non-verified ranked times and distances are prone to faking several times on this forum. It is a fair case, but you don't have to agree. No reason to remove him from the rankings and no childish behaviour either, imo.
He faked the verification and f. S up the system. Proving he is talking bull out of his lazy ass.

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hjs
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by hjs » February 6th, 2020, 4:31 am

nates wrote:
February 5th, 2020, 4:25 pm
I'm not sure what the fuss is over, but since you bring it up how about this 2k time (forget watts - it's 9.2 HP)
9

1 Sean Hensley 46 Peninsula, OH USA 2:31.0 No
The fuss is about ranking results you don,t have done. For lots of people the rankings are important, he tries to take that away from them.

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Citroen
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by Citroen » February 6th, 2020, 5:29 am

Carl Watts wrote:
February 5th, 2020, 10:13 pm
How did I do it ? I'm not telling anyone the secret is safe and yes it still did still involve me actually rowing and its highly unlikely that anyone else in the world can replicate it.
Anyone with some experience in building circuits can do this.

The performance monitors get a sawtooth signal from the flywheel sensor where the frequency is proportional to the flywheel speed. They see rising edge and duration from the flywheel signal and use that as the input to the complex maths it's doing.

Generating a sawtooth easy to do if you have NE555 (crude 555 based generators are a dime a dozen on eBay). You can get a crude sawtooth wave between pin#2 and GND (with the frequency depending on the electrolytic capacitor you've got there).

It's more adjustable with an op amp on pin#3 of the NE555 wired as a simple square wave generator.
http://www.circuitstoday.com/sawtooth-wave-generator

Carl will have a bench signal generator as part of his test kit needed to repair old PMs, the input level needed is less than 0.010 volt (as the flywheel sensor is much the same as a microphone). It's easy to set that up to create a specific pace and SPM on a PM.

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max_ratcliffe
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by max_ratcliffe » February 6th, 2020, 7:22 am

Citroen wrote:
February 6th, 2020, 5:29 am
Carl Watts wrote:
February 5th, 2020, 10:13 pm
How did I do it ? I'm not telling anyone the secret is safe and yes it still did still involve me actually rowing and its highly unlikely that anyone else in the world can replicate it.
Anyone with some experience in building circuits can do this.

The performance monitors get a sawtooth signal from the flywheel sensor where the frequency is proportional to the flywheel speed. They see rising edge and duration from the flywheel signal and use that as the input to the complex maths it's doing.

Generating a sawtooth easy to do if you have NE555 (crude 555 based generators are a dime a dozen on eBay). You can get a crude sawtooth wave between pin#2 and GND (with the frequency depending on the electrolytic capacitor you've got there).

It's more adjustable with an op amp on pin#3 of the NE555 wired as a simple square wave generator.
http://www.circuitstoday.com/sawtooth-wave-generator

Carl will have a bench signal generator as part of his test kit needed to repair old PMs, the input level needed is less than 0.010 volt (as the flywheel sensor is much the same as a microphone). It's easy to set that up to create a specific pace and SPM on a PM.
C'mon guys.

Carl has made his point. He should now reclaim the moral high ground by deleting his fabricated results.

Doug, I don't think telling people how to enter non-legit "verified" workouts is helpful. Most of us are adult enough to not make up times and distances, but you only need to look at the rankings to find some fraudulent pieces. The easier it is to tinker under the hood, the harder it will be to police proper rankings.

Part of the wonder of the C2 machines is that we know that one machine is (more or less) the same as any other. The rankings are a very important aspect of that. Let's help C2 do what they can to make the rankings as representative as they can be.
50 HWT
PBs:
Rower 1'=329m; 500m=1:34.0; 1k=3:25:1; 2k=7:16.5; 5k=19:44; 6k=23:24; 30'=7534m; 10k=40.28; 60'=14621m; HM=1:27:46
SkiErg 1'=298m; 500m=1:42.4; 1k=TBC; 2k=7:43.8; 5k=20:34.8; 6k=TBC; 30'=TBC; 10k=42:50; 60'=TBC; HM=NGTFH

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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by Dangerscouse » February 6th, 2020, 7:26 am

max_ratcliffe wrote:
February 6th, 2020, 7:22 am

C'mon guys.

Carl has made his point. He should now reclaim the moral high ground by deleting his fabricated results.

Doug, I don't think telling people how to enter non-legit "verified" workouts is helpful. Most of us are adult enough to not make up times and distances, but you only need to look at the rankings to find some fraudulent pieces. The easier it is to tinker under the hood, the harder it will be to police proper rankings.

Part of the wonder of the C2 machines is that we know that one machine is (more or less) the same as any other. The rankings are a very important aspect of that. Let's help C2 do what they can to make the rankings as representative as they can be.
Totally agree Max.
47 HWT; 6' 4"; 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:24; 6k= 21:09; 10k= 35:46 30mins= 8,428m 60mins= 16,461m HM= 1:16.47; FM= 2:44:04; 50k= 3:16:09; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you row"

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Citroen
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Re: Childish behavier.

Post by Citroen » February 6th, 2020, 7:59 am

max_ratcliffe wrote:
February 6th, 2020, 7:22 am

Doug, I don't think telling people how to enter non-legit "verified" workouts is helpful. Most of us are adult enough to not make up times and distances, but you only need to look at the rankings to find some fraudulent pieces. The easier it is to tinker under the hood, the harder it will be to police proper rankings.
Nonsense, if you can see an external vulnerability that has been used in public you should pubish it.

You'd have to be a proper saddo to use that other than to prove a point that the verification system can be gamed. In fact, you have to be a proper saddo to exploit it as Carl has done.

The bottom line is Concept2 have no reason to change this stuff (it's going to cost money and won't be retrofitted to most of the monitors out there). In the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter and the only person who has the a massive Indonesian resin bee in his bonnet about the verification system is Carl.

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