Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

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sadsac74
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Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by sadsac74 » December 14th, 2018, 6:29 pm

Hi im after some advise on the best way to improve my rowing times or what is the best training for improving. At the minute I just go flat out for for the distance I'm rowing every time I row.

My best time of recent is 7:22 for 2k at resistance 10

19:23 for 5k resistance 10

I am aiming my goals at 7 mins 2k and 19 mins 5k. In my younger years I managed sub 7 mins 2K and under 18 mins for 5K.

I'm 44 years young and 95kgs I also cycle and swim.

I'm new to the site so be gentle please. Any advise is welcome on training.

Cheers

edinborogh
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by edinborogh » December 14th, 2018, 10:43 pm


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Ombrax
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by Ombrax » December 15th, 2018, 3:51 am

sadsac74 wrote:
December 14th, 2018, 6:29 pm
My best time of recent is 7:22 for 2k at resistance 10

19:23 for 5k resistance 10
:
:
Any advise is welcome on training.
You may want to familiarize yourself with the damper setting and the Drag Factor.

That vast majority of serious rowers do not use such high damper.

Search the forum or the C2 web site for "drag factor" and you'll get some good information.

(Bottom line, most folks use a DF around 100-140, and unless your rower's flywheel area hasn't been cleaned in a long, long time and is super dirty, a damper setting of 10 will be much higher than that.)

Good Luck

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jimmyshand
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by jimmyshand » December 15th, 2018, 4:49 am

sadsac74 wrote:
December 14th, 2018, 6:29 pm
Hi im after some advise on the best way to improve my rowing times or what is the best training for improving. At the minute I just go flat out for for the distance I'm rowing every time I row.

My best time of recent is 7:22 for 2k at resistance 10

19:23 for 5k resistance 10

I am aiming my goals at 7 mins 2k and 19 mins 5k. In my younger years I managed sub 7 mins 2K and under 18 mins for 5K.

I'm 44 years young and 95kgs I also cycle and swim.

I'm new to the site so be gentle please. Any advise is welcome on training.

Cheers
Welcome! My suggestions would be as follows. Apologies if any of this is obvious.

1. Stop rowing with the damper set to 10 and instead find out what 'drag factor' you are rowing at. This is the important number, since of course it's not 'resistance' that we're adjusting but a 'drag', or how the stroke might feel. The complication is that in older gym machines there is often a lot of dust in the flywheel and this messes things up so really it's best to set the drag at something much lower than max. I use about 115-125 drag factor for most pieces including 2k and 5k. You should experiment with it a bit though as everyone is different but as a rule maxing out the drag factor by putting the damper lever to 10 is a bad idea. See below for how to check drag if you didn't already know.

2. I'd do a lot more long, slow and steady rows if I were you. That's what people here advised me to do and it's made a big difference. I also do intervals but to be honest the bulk of my training is steady state (SS) rows at about 22spm.

3. Stop going flat out every time you row. It's very tempting but counter-productive if you want to improve. I also did a bit of this at first but it really does help to do longer pieces. I do a lot of 10k and hour pieces at low stroke rates and this has helped build a good base of fitness. From your previous times it sounds like you were pretty fit so good luck.



To view drag factor on the PM:

On the Main Menu, select More Options.
Select Display Drag Factor.
Begin rowing or skiing. The PM will display the drag factor after a few seconds.
43 years old - 198cm/6'6" - England

PBs -
1k 3:15.4 (Jun 2020) | 2k 6:51.4 (Feb 2019) | 5k 18:16.9 (Oct 2019) | 30min 8,016m (Apr 2019) | 10k 37:53.6 (May 2019) | 60min 15,254m (Apr 2019) | HM 1:25:38.4 (Apr 2019)

Rowing since March 2017. Real name is Alasdair.

jamesg
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by jamesg » December 15th, 2018, 7:12 am

First check your technique; those targets are easy with a good stroke, if you have the endurance.

The C2 site has the know-how:
https://www.concept2.com/indoor-rowers/ ... que-videos

You could train at ratings 20 - 23 and 200 - 250 Watt for 30-40 minutes a day. A drag factor of 130 or less could help you do that by allowing a long stroke.
08-1940, 183cm, 87kg. Last seen MHR 162, in 2k (2020-05-16) 8.47.5@24

sadsac74
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by sadsac74 » December 15th, 2018, 8:01 pm

Thanks for the advise guys I haven't even heard of drag factor I just assumed that the more resistance would improve my strength and row times. That could be the reason rowing flat out at that high resistance is why i'm unable to row every day?

I'll look into the drag factor and go by the quoted numbers 100-130 that you have advised.

I normally go by my heart rate for 5K i try to stay about 80% of my max for 4K then flat out for the last 1000 metres. My max heart rate is 185 and is easily pushed up to that the time i have finished lol.

I have been off the rower for a few years because of a knee injury, I had a water rower at home and was always trying to match my C2 times and damaged my knee. Like I said absolutely no idea about training just rowed my ass off!!

Thanks

Dangerscouse
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by Dangerscouse » December 16th, 2018, 8:48 am

I reiterate what Jimmy says, don't go flat out every time. Slow steady state sessions are just as important. If you can spare the time try and do a 60 mins, or more, session at a circa 2k pace + 20/22 secs and at 20-22spm.

The drag will feel really light to start with so lower it slowly if it feels too light.

What spm are you rowing at the moment? It's ideal to be able to cope as easily with 20 as it is with 30
46 HWT; 6' 4"; 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:24; 6k= 21:09; 10k= 35:46 30mins= 8,428m 60mins= 16,331m HM= 1:18:25; FM= 2:45:49; 50k= 3:21:14; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you row"

Instagram: stuwenman

sadsac74
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by sadsac74 » December 16th, 2018, 4:25 pm

I normally hold about 29 spm for 5k with the damper set at 10 for 2k about 31 spm.
So if I'm rowing at 1:50 pace for 2k at the moment add 20-22 seconds onto that with a df of between 100-130 with a stroke rate of 20-20 spm? Is that correct.

Sorry like I've said I've never done any structured training just rowed.

Cheers

Dangerscouse
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by Dangerscouse » December 16th, 2018, 5:29 pm

sadsac74 wrote:
December 16th, 2018, 4:25 pm
I normally hold about 29 spm for 5k with the damper set at 10 for 2k about 31 spm.
So if I'm rowing at 1:50 pace for 2k at the moment add 20-22 seconds onto that with a df of between 100-130 with a stroke rate of 20-20 spm? Is that correct.

Sorry like I've said I've never done any structured training just rowed.

Cheers
Yes mate that's right and there's no need to apologise we were all beginners at the start. Going 20 secs slower will be working in the UT2 zone (fat burning) and will lay the aerobic base fitness that is required for every session, to lesser or more degrees, over 1km.

I generally find 22/23 spm is good as it's more transferable to when you stroke faster, but getting used to the power required for 20spm is useful too. It will feel slow to start with so just increase the power in your drive if you feel it's too slow, but everything feels good for a while so don't get too optimistic too early on. It's better to finish a 60 mins session feeling like you could go faster next time than stopping halfway as you went off too fast. You can also split it into intervals, say, 3 x 15 mins or 3 x 4km with 2 or 3 mins rest, or less time/distance to fit what you want to do. Trying to do an unbroken 60 mins takes some practice and may not be possible for a while yet, if at all. Some people just don't like the longer distances and are more suited to 5k and less.

I have only done structured training for about 18 months, before then for years I also just whacked out 10k sessions and a 10 mile session on weekends. I had no variety or concept of slower strokes. The good thing is that you have got a good aerobic base fitness with rowing at 29spm, and that's a lot harder and slower to build then power in the form of 20-22spm.

Drag is very subjective so just play around and see what works best for you and don't feel like it should be higher or lower than what feels comfortable. There are no prizes for a high drag.
46 HWT; 6' 4"; 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:24; 6k= 21:09; 10k= 35:46 30mins= 8,428m 60mins= 16,331m HM= 1:18:25; FM= 2:45:49; 50k= 3:21:14; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you row"

Instagram: stuwenman

sadsac74
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by sadsac74 » April 4th, 2019, 2:41 pm

Hi Guys

so I've taken your advice on what have read and over the last couple of months this is the results so far.

rowing at DF 130 all the time

2K 7.30

5K 19 mins

10K 41 mins

1 hour 14,425 metres

when on the hour row i average about 160-170 watts stroke rate average 23-24 do these figures sound correct I read in one of the previous comments i should aim for 200-250 watts. i don't think that is doable for me at the moment. Is that wattage high to aim for.

any more comments or advice is so welcome

Thanks

Alex

Dangerscouse
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Re: Advise on how to improve row times 2k and 5k

Post by Dangerscouse » April 4th, 2019, 5:00 pm

You want to aim for 200-250 watts but if it's not there yet, don't worry just keep chipping away at it and you'll get there soon enough.

Also doing a 60 mins row is a long distance so don't forget your wattage will naturally drop as you need to pace yourself. A 30 mins session is probably better to check on wattage
46 HWT; 6' 4"; 1k= 3:09; 2k= 6:36; 5k= 17:24; 6k= 21:09; 10k= 35:46 30mins= 8,428m 60mins= 16,331m HM= 1:18:25; FM= 2:45:49; 50k= 3:21:14; 100k= 7:52:44; 12hrs = 153km

"You reap what you row"

Instagram: stuwenman

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