Can you make gains on the erg and with weights?

[Gammmmo]

I'm struggling to make gains with weights now that I'm getting >50km/week in on the erg plus occasional short run or bike ride. The erging is very slowly getting better. I do a 1hr weights session generally Mon/Tues and train biceps, triceps, chest, lats mainly, and then Thurs/Fri I often do a lesser home session mainly focusing on biceps and chest. Take for example my biceps curls - in the gym I've plateaued now for weeks using 20kg dumb bells for around 9 reps. I am the classic ectomorph with a long history of aerobic sport with just a little weight training here and there, so will always struggle in the weights room. Anyone been here before and have any strategies?

[Anth_F]

Yes, but only when you train the right parts of the body. Upper body stuff that you are doing won't have much affect at all. It's all about the legs. Barbell squats... deadlifts etc.

[Gammmmo]

Yeah I know training biceps/triceps/chest won't help erging. It doesn't mean I don't want to make gains though.

[Anth_F]

I've lost you completely with that last comment

It's simple... want to make more erg gains? start doing at least those exercises i mentioned

i don't see them mentioned in your post.

[Pie Man]

I think Gammmmo wants to balance himself out a bit in the top half rather than just develop the erg muscles.

[Anth_F]

Title of the post "Can you make gains on the erg and with weights"

So i gave him some suggestions

I'm out.

[Gammmmo]

I think Gammmmo wants to balance himself out a bit in the top half rather than just develop the erg muscles.

Yes.

OK, I am aware the best exercises to help with erging are squats and deadlifts. I'm reluctant to do squats (I know they are the king of exercises for a variety of reasons) because I suspect they'll be v hard to recover from. My lower back isn't in great shape - even light deadlifting leaves it v stiff. Now, so far I've been doing weights exercises to help me put on weight (obviously eating is key) and out of pure vanity. I don't care if they complement erging. I know how to get faster on the erg, but what I'm saying is with the weights exercises I have been doing e.g. bicep curls, I've seen a plateau. Doing lots of cardio doesn't help when trying to maximise weight training gains and putting on size. So...my question is how do I do both and keep on getting gains with both?

[G-dub]

Gammo, I made gains doing both no problem. I am not sure how you can't really, but we all are different. I am built more for carrying things I guess. This time around I have been more focused on the bigger moves such as deadlifts with a trap bar, standing military press, bench press. I don't have a squat rack so don't do those. I do swing a KB too. Just lift the stuff, add more weight when you feel it, eat, lift some more, add more weight when you feel it, eat. etc. Don't waste energy on body building programs though. Just lift heavy things for a few reps and sets and save energy for your erging work.

[Gammmmo]

Gammo, I made gains doing both no problem. I am not sure how you can't really, but we all are different. I am built more for carrying things I guess. This time around I have been more focused on the bigger moves such as deadlifts with a trap bar, standing military press, bench press. I don't have a squat rack so don't do those. I do swing a KB too. Just lift the stuff, add more weight when you feel it, eat, lift some more, add more weight when you feel it, eat. etc. Don't waste energy on body building programs though -you will work all the muscles with the big moves anyway. Just lift heavy things for a few reps and sets and save energy for your erging work.

Yes, one weakness I can see with my weights routine is not enough focus on "basic" compound exercises. Typically when I go there I do:

incline bicep curls
incline dumb bell pressing
chin-ups (narrow and wide grip)
triceps pushdowns
triceps - dumb bell behind the head
T-bar row

I added chinups more recently thinking it would be a better compound exercise (compared with the isolation movement - incline bicep curls)...but it's not made any difference. Like I say I'm stuck around 9 reps with biceps curls using 20kg dumb bells. Creatine mono instantly gave me a few more reps but I've had that gain!

At home I do a lighter sessions = dumb bell curls, pushups, and sometimes lying triceps dips.

[Anth_F]

I think Gammmmo wants to balance himself out a bit in the top half rather than just develop the erg muscles.

Yes.

OK, I am aware the best exercises to help with erging are squats and deadlifts. I'm reluctant to do squats (I know they are the king of exercises for a variety of reasons) because I suspect they'll be v hard to recover from. My lower back isn't in great shape - even light deadlifting leaves it v stiff. Now, so far I've been doing weights exercises to help me put on weight (obviously eating is key) and out of pure vanity. I don't care if they complement erging. I know how to get faster on the erg, but what I'm saying is with the weights exercises I have been doing e.g. bicep curls, I've seen a plateau. Doing lots of cardio doesn't help when trying to maximise weight training gains and putting on size. So...my question is how do I do both and keep on getting gains with both?

Riiiight!! I misunderstood, sorry.

Well that was also my problem, i couldn't get the gains i wanted with the weights due to doing lots of steady state meters rowing. But once i cut back a bit on steady state long sessions and also started lifting heavier stuff & (less reps) I am now starting to see much improved results from the weights, especially my top half & getting much much stronger.

Btw, if you are suffering lower back issues, start incorporating more core work into your training. Planks, hyperextensions will really help a great deal.

[G-dub]

Forget the curls. Do deadlifts, standing overhead shoulder presses, pull ups and Kbell swings. Do a weight that you can do 2 sets of 5. Do it more often. Add weight when it feels too easy. No need to rush. All this is a knock off of what Dan John, who Luke and I and others have been talking about, says. It worked for me anyway. I currently am not doing much weights, though, because of the demands of the PP. But when I was only doing SS and maybe one day of intensity rowing I could lift almost every day. I just didn't overdo the sets/reps and need to add weight as aggressively as a body builder would.

[Gammmmo]

Btw, if you are suffering lower back issues, start incorporating more core work into your training. Planks, hyperextensions will really help a great deal.

that is something I have let slide...I think is does indeed need to be brought back

Forget the curls. Do deadlifts, standing overhead shoulder presses, pull ups and Kbell swings. Do a weight that you can do 2 sets of 5. Do it more often. Add weight when it feels too easy. No need to rush. All this is a knock off of what Dan John, who Luke and I and others have been talking about, says. It worked for me anyway. I currently am not doing much weights, though, because of the demands of the PP. But when I was only doing SS and maybe one day of intensity rowing I could lift almost every day. I just didn't overdo the sets/reps and need to add weight as aggressively as a body builder would.

OK. Do you always lift to failure?

[Masterninja]

Gammmo, small suggestion. If the lower back issue is the reason you are reluctant to do squats/deads, see if your gym has a trap bar or see if you can purchase one for your home workouts. Often times people find they can deadlift without any pain when using the trap bar because it allows for a much more upright posture since you stand in the middle of the weight. Additionally, I find it to be a good substitute for squats because it works the quads to a greater degree due to the center of gravity and bar path being different. Definitely worth a shot. Best of luck sir!

[Anth_F]

Btw, if you are suffering lower back issues, start incorporating more core work into your training. Planks, hyperextensions will really help a great deal.

that is something I have let slide...I think is does indeed need to be brought back

Yes... bring it back, ASAP. Also, make sure you are getting in plenty of protein to aid more faster gains. This was something i thought i was getting enough of, but as it turned out, my volume wasn't enough due to all of my activity!!! Since i started getting in more volume of protein it's made a big difference.

[G-dub]

No lifting to failure for me. I fail enough at other stuff. Just lift. Lift often. Add weight when it gets too light. Look back in a few months and see the progress.

And I love my trap bar like master ninja says. It puts the emphasis somewhere between squat and deadlift. Less strain on low back.