Skierg Force Curve

Talk about the ski ergometer and training tool from Concept2
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Old Gringo
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Skierg Force Curve

Post by Old Gringo » February 11th, 2017, 8:13 pm

What should the force curve on the Skierg look like?

Balkan boy
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by Balkan boy » February 15th, 2017, 7:54 am

I haven't come across information on what the force curve should be.
I'm still improving my technique on every pull, and I can see it in the force curve.
When I do the correct sequence and pull smoothly trough the stroke I get the best time and the smoothest curve.

This is what my steady state pace typically looks like:
(this was taken after a hard session so it's a bit jagged)
Image.

It looks similar for hard intervals, only with a higher peak and a bit shorter.

dr3do
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by dr3do » June 2nd, 2017, 2:25 am

Would be nice to read something like this, but for SkiErg.

Image

http://www.biorow.com/RBN_en_2006_files ... News05.pdf

Does anybody know if there's some (free available) information out there?
Boris (Bike/SkiErg/RowErg)

Balkan boy
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by Balkan boy » June 2nd, 2017, 5:47 am

Do you know any Scandinavian language?
I bet they could tell us something interesting about using this machine.

After a lot of trawling (in English) I gave up searching for this type of information.

You could try a brute force search with something like this: https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3A ... e&ie=UTF-8


Looking at that picture in my earlier post, that force curve looks wimpy.
I've improved the shape and smoothness a lot over the past 1Mm. If only I could do the same with force production.

dr3do
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by dr3do » June 2nd, 2017, 6:57 am

Balkan boy wrote:Do you know any Scandinavian language?
Unfortunately no. :(
I bet they could tell us something interesting about using this machine.
Definitely. Saw some good YT vids, but when you don't understand what they talk about, it's hard/impossible to draw a good conclusion for yourself
Boris (Bike/SkiErg/RowErg)

Paul N
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by Paul N » February 22nd, 2019, 5:28 pm

I have only recently been looking a bit more into SkiErg technique (and also XC ski technique for comparison). Today was the first time I looked at the SkiErg force curve...

I found this interesting newsletter from the Biorow website:

http://www.biorow.com/RBN_en_2010_files ... News12.pdf

Figure 3 shows a very similar shape as per rowing (my curve shape was not too dissimilar: similar to Balkan boy's photo above).
Figure 5 shows the trunk and legs produced more power in the first half of the drive, then the arms in the second half.

Comparing XC ski and SkiErg, it's interesting to see that there is a deeper squat on the SkiErg (knees more bent) but a bigger hip-hinge in XC ski. The forward lean in XC ski (Fig 1a) is also very interesting. I tried to experiment with more of a XC ski technique today, but it's too early to say whether it was better for me - more practice required (and I also need to fully recover from a cold: the C2 machines are very unforgiving when you come back to them from a few days off due to illness!)

However, in contrast to the above, I also saw this on Justin Farina's instagram - scroll right to the final video of the post:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BlN8dAkFfBF/

That's a very front-loaded curve with a long tail. I wonder if Justin is using his lats/arms very early in the sequence compared to the Biorow tests?
Row: 500m 2:04.7 | 1k 4:19.4 | 2k 8:55.4 | 5k 23:13.7 | 6k 28:43.9 | 10k 49:31.8 | 1min 257m | 4min 908m | 30min 6,328m
Ski: 500m 2:18.8 | 1k 4:58.8 | 2k 10:01.6 | 5k 25:59.7 | 10k 52:44.7

RayOfSunshine
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by RayOfSunshine » February 22nd, 2019, 6:03 pm

I'm new to the SkiErg... I was wondering about this because I don't want to start with bad form.

I'm on FB only for rowing and, now, skierg. I'm in a skierg group. I'll ask them.
48M, 175cm/5'9", 74.8kg/165lbs
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hjs
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by hjs » February 23rd, 2019, 4:41 am

Don,t think rower and skier are much alike, rower for me has more peakforce and is steeper, skierg is very frontlaoded with a long tail.

Re squat skierg, hardly squat at all, its all hiphinge for me. And still find it hard to go fast.
Other thing is recovery, skierg is easier on this, the rower digs deeper in your overall reserves. Think its because we do recrute the bigger muscle more.
For my training see twitter @Hjsrowing

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hjs
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by hjs » March 10th, 2019, 1:50 pm

https://www.instagram.com/p/BuiEo8glzi-/

Paul Jeffrey on the skierg. Has a different technique. Pulls 1.04 lowpull and can rate very high this way, hardly any hiphinge. Pulls only vertical.

Wr sprint, in the 50 plus cath, both on the rower and skierg. Yes he is big, but still there are more big guys, nobody touches him..
For my training see twitter @Hjsrowing

RayOfSunshine
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by RayOfSunshine » March 10th, 2019, 10:52 pm

hjs wrote:
March 10th, 2019, 1:50 pm
https://www.instagram.com/p/BuiEo8glzi-/

Paul Jeffrey on the skierg. Has a different technique. Pulls 1.04 lowpull and can rate very high this way, hardly any hiphinge. Pulls only vertical.

Wr sprint, in the 50 plus cath, both on the rower and skierg. Yes he is big, but still there are more big guys, nobody touches him..
Dadgum... that's insane. I got winded watching him.
48M, 175cm/5'9", 74.8kg/165lbs
Neptune Beach, FL/Boone, NC

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hjs
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by hjs » March 11th, 2019, 3:40 am

RayOfSunshine wrote:
March 10th, 2019, 10:52 pm
hjs wrote:
March 10th, 2019, 1:50 pm
https://www.instagram.com/p/BuiEo8glzi-/

Paul Jeffrey on the skierg. Has a different technique. Pulls 1.04 lowpull and can rate very high this way, hardly any hiphinge. Pulls only vertical.

Wr sprint, in the 50 plus cath, both on the rower and skierg. Yes he is big, but still there are more big guys, nobody touches him..
Dadgum... that's insane. I got winded watching him.
Me too Guy is a beast. Powerfull.
For my training see twitter @Hjsrowing

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johnlvs2run
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Re: Skierg Force Curve

Post by johnlvs2run » April 10th, 2019, 1:15 am

The Biorow photo is not a good form for the Skierg, for one thing because the guy has his eyes fixated on the monitor instead of focusing on the movement. Justin Farina is fast and has a few records; however he lifts back up with his torso while still pushing down with his arms, which is quite inefficient. He would likely be faster and more enduring with better coordination between them.

Here's a clip of Kate Hilliard doing her women's 2k world record, and a clip of Paul Jeffrey doing a 100m record for the 50 to 59 age group. He has a good form, but he's stifling his air supply with all the noise that he makes, which would limit him greatly over longer distances. Notice both Hilliard and Jeffrey have a full coordinated movement all the way through, albeit at different speeds and paces. Also Johan Olsson on skis.

I like Kate Hiliard's (and Olsson's) form the best, and try to emulate it, but don't reach that high, and my cords aren't long enough to go any lower. I already hit the bottom of them every stroke, which is barely below my knees. If I ever get another set, I'll try to get longer ones.
73 5'8 155
age 70+ world record pace per weight percentages
skierg: 100m 87.4 / 500m 86.2 / 1k 85.9 / 2k 89.4 / 5k 87.6 / 10k 89.4 / 60' 92.0 / 21k 93.6
my training log

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