What strength training plans/cross-training plans you usually do? Any recommendations for me?

[PleaseLockIn]

Trying to get back into rowing but my splits have been slightly disappointing, with a 10 HR increase over them from before.

Felt as if I was lacking strength significantly more than cardio at R20. And yes... my high rates will suffer badly but i can train them later

Do I still continue with https://rowingstronger.com/ 2x a week or Stronglifts 5x5? What do you guys usually do?

Also what do you guys usually do for crosstraining?

[Dangerscouse]

I'm obviously a lot older than you so this probably isn't very applicable, but all I do is one full body training session a week (Monday night) and a hot dynamic pilates class once a week (Thursday morning).

In years gone by, I used to weight training three times a week, but that hasn't happened for about 15 years. I also didn't really train very well, and I didn't make much progress.

I'd definitely recommend doing calisthenics if you're not very strong, as your ego will won't play such a dominant role.

There's loads of ways to make it more difficult if something becomes easier, so progression isn't an issue, especially with some relatively light weight dumbbells added to the mix. Maybe starting with this type of training will make rowing more manageable too.

[jcross485]

Trying to get back into rowing but my splits have been slightly disappointing, with a 10 HR increase over them from before.

Felt as if I was lacking strength significantly more than cardio at R20. And yes... my high rates will suffer badly but i can train them later

Do I still continue with https://rowingstronger.com/ 2x a week or Stronglifts 5x5? What do you guys usually do?

Also what do you guys usually do for crosstraining?

What is your actual goal with strength training? Is it to get stronger and potentially bigger or is it to specifically improve rowing / erg performance?

I ask as I came to the erg in my mid to late 30's. I spent many, many years after collegiate athletics focusing on nothing but strength training for the sake of being as strong as possible, then spent a bit of time doing a lot of long distance running. I still strength train and I think it's incredibly important but my strength training now is set up much differently than when I was squatting over 500lbs and deadlifting over 600lbs at sub-200lbs bodyweight.

[PleaseLockIn]

Trying to get back into rowing but my splits have been slightly disappointing, with a 10 HR increase over them from before.

Felt as if I was lacking strength significantly more than cardio at R20. And yes... my high rates will suffer badly but i can train them later

Do I still continue with https://rowingstronger.com/ 2x a week or Stronglifts 5x5? What do you guys usually do?

Also what do you guys usually do for crosstraining?

What is your actual goal with strength training? Is it to get stronger and potentially bigger or is it to specifically improve rowing / erg performance?

I ask as I came to the erg in my mid to late 30's. I spent many, many years after collegiate athletics focusing on nothing but strength training for the sake of being as strong as possible, then spent a bit of time doing a lot of long distance running. I still strength train and I think it's incredibly important but my strength training now is set up much differently than when I was squatting over 500lbs and deadlifting over 600lbs at sub-200lbs bodyweight.

Now, it is more to improve erg performance than getting stronger and bigger, though my squat and deadlift PBs are months old at this point and I am frankly somewhat small

Those lifts are pretty strong! I’m pretty weak in comparison though in my gym I’m one of the stronger guys.

Idk what strength standards there are for rowing other than https://www.researchgate.net/profile/St ... Rowers.pdf but if this is any accurate I ain’t that weak

Preferably those plans suited for long distance low rate?

[Sakly]

Based on my experience I would say raw strength helps good at short distance <=500m. Any longer distances don't benefit so much from strength in general.
On low rate the game changes a bit, but brute strength again only helps for short distance. If you need to go for 30 minutes, max strength won't get you there. You need more strength endurance, which is quite below your max strength levels and they are not necessarily linked to your max strength capabilities.
Because of this fact, I believe it is much more beneficial to incorporate strength exercises like squat and deadlifts in a higher rep range and lower weights to get a similar training effect needed for a low rate rowing workout. I used to do 100x50kg (and as it progressed, 100x60, 90x70, 80x80, 50x100) as example, as many reps as possible in one go, rest as needed, but trying to shorten to a bare minimum. This is a much different training as a pure strength session doing 5x5 or something similar.

[p_b82]

My personal take on it - is that you can't ignore the high rate training and "work on it later" because it is something that is intrinsic to your overall rowing endurance & the performance of it now is going to be of large value.

Only erging at a low rate makes the body adapt to only rowing at a low rate - what you want is that you drop the rate and it feels "easy" because you're used to rowing harder & faster.
You'll obviously never meet your un-restricted pace, but if you can't hit 7500m unrestricted rate in 30mins, you're simply not going to be able to do at r20.

As has been said on other theads - there are many rowers/ergers out there that do zero specific strength work and became exceptional rowers.

But if you do feel that you need to do some specific exercises I'd second Sakly's recommendation of endurance not max rep strength.

[jcross485]

Now, it is more to improve erg performance than getting stronger and bigger, though my squat and deadlift PBs are months old at this point and I am frankly somewhat small

Those lifts are pretty strong! I’m pretty weak in comparison though in my gym I’m one of the stronger guys.

Idk what strength standards there are for rowing other than https://www.researchgate.net/profile/St ... Rowers.pdf but if this is any accurate I ain’t that weak

Preferably those plans suited for long distance low rate?

It's all relative; I was strong but in my gym at the time, I was a pretty average lifter. My lifts have up dropped off but I still maintain about a 500lbs deadlift (looking to keep this lift up or put some more strength back on) and am doing mainly weighted pull-ups and weighted dips as my upper body lifts.

There were and are a lot of really high level rowers who were exceptional without dedicated strength work. To say that you have to do strength work to be good in the boat or on the erg would be false IMO; however, it's more about stacking cards in your favor. That said, I am not them, and most of us are not them. I personally feel as though incorporating strength work helps much more than it hurts. As I get older, it's also important for reasons other than just <insert sport> performance.

I would look into strength programs written by strength coaches that are designed more for athletes or folks who are using strength training as general physical preparedness (GPP) for other activities. At the end of the day, strength training is nothing but general training if it's not the actual focus. This seems to apply to you if you're looking to improve rowing performance as well as any athlete for that matter.

I've always been a big fan of and advocate for the Wendler 5/3/1 program. One issue that some have with it is that it is a very general template or guide with a lot of flexibility so people can get in their own way a bit. With his athletes, he generally has strength work done two to three times per week with one main barbell lift a day and two to three assistance lifts per day such that each session is rather full body. Another program to look into is Tactical Barbell - I personally prefer either the operator template or the fighter template depending on how many times per week you want to do strength work.

Both of these programs do take a more long term approach to training so they tend to be relatively slow and conservative with loading, but that is perfect IMO for those who are using strength training to compliment or supplement other pursuits.

A few mentioned focusing more on strength endurance than strength. I don't think either are wrong per se, I just look at it a bit different. I'll caveat this with the fact that I do and have done a lot of bodyweight (or weight vest) circuits where I do a pretty high volume of pull-ups, push-ups, and walking lunges. These sessions though have become more of a replacement or substitute for when I can't get on an erg and want to train in a manner than puts some stress on the muscular system while elevating the HR and keeping it up for a period of time. I do think that you need to build your top end a bit and not just do higher rep stuff. To me, it's like doing nothing but steady state work. Yes, you can get fit and fast doing nothing but steady state with the occasional test piece, but you will undoubtedly be better if you mix in the sharper, more intense stuff from time to time.

On the low rate piece comment, I think doing a good amount of low rate training does help to reinforce technique and a strong stroke, but don't neglect higher rates for an extended period as they need to be trained and they are a skill that is needed to go fast.

[milansanremo]

My personal take on it - is that you can't ignore the high rate training and "work on it later" because it is something that is intrinsic to your overall rowing endurance & the performance of it now is going to be of large value.

Only erging at a low rate makes the body adapt to only rowing at a low rate - what you want is that you drop the rate and it feels "easy" because you're used to rowing harder & faster.
You'll obviously never meet your un-restricted pace, but if you can't hit 7500m unrestricted rate in 30mins, you're simply not going to be able to do at r20.

As has been said on other theads - there are many rowers/ergers out there that do zero specific strength work and became exceptional rowers.

But if you do feel that you need to do some specific exercises I'd second Sakly's recommendation of endurance not max rep strength.

What you said above is "exactly" the conclusion that I've come to as a new rower. I'm going "full bore" at becoming comfortable (or having the ability to go temporarily insane) at r35-37. Eric. Murray proved that this path can be a successful one. I'm sold on this strategy. This is very consistent with the winning strategy of developing a low gear and extremely high cadence pedaling style which was imposed on me as a young cyclist.
Developing this early enabled me to win Cat1-2 races against older racers and average 30mph as a 17 year old Junior racer with a gear restriction (52x15).
Naturally, the two sports are remarkably similar but also remarkably different but my mind understands that it has the potential to be successful.

[alex9026]

Let's not ignore that Murray came from a rugby background (I believe) so no doubt had a solid strength foundation. This is easier to maintain than it is to build and he won't necessarily have to resort to weights for this. Let's say his strength regressed a little, he will have still been at the ceiling of what we might consider "strong enough" for a rower.

[flatbread]

I know that a lot of higher volume ergers haven't had rib issues, but, the erg does really load up the thoracic cavity, so regular push ups and scapular push ups, to strengthen the serratus anterior and the rhomboids, wouldn't be a bad idea.

[H2O]

In order to transfer the power of the legs to the arms you need a strong core. That's why I do core exercises. The Athlean-X channel (you-tube) has some good ideas (variations on planks, side blanks, hollow holds, pilates-100s, some others). Since I no longer have access to a gym I have some exercise bands and kettle bells. The bizarre looking kettle bell swing is actually very effective in driving up my heart rate fairly quickly (as some sort of replacement for the sprints which I do not do). Squat-jumps have the same effect. Weighted squats, ones sided carries (a core exercise). The "Bioneer" channel (you-tube) has some ideas.
For me the core is the weak link.
Another good idea is one legged rowing. I can maintain UT2 pace at the same stroke rate and watts/stroke. A recent set was 20 x 2 mins, rest 20 secs, alternate the legs. I like this idea in particular since it loads the core aysmmetrically so forces the core to work on stabilization.
I also do this in warmups now since it switches on the legs more.

[flatbread]

In order to transfer the power of the legs to the arms you need a strong core. That's why I do core exercises. The Athlean-X channel (you-tube) has some good ideas (variations on planks, side blanks, hollow holds, pilates-100s, some others). Since I no longer have access to a gym I have some exercise bands and kettle bells. The bizarre looking kettle bell swing is actually very effective in driving up my heart rate fairly quickly (as some sort of replacement for the sprints which I do not do). Squat-jumps have the same effect. Weighted squats, ones sided carries (a core exercise). The "Bioneer" channel (you-tube) has some ideas.
For me the core is the weak link.
Another good idea is one legged rowing. I can maintain UT2 pace at the same stroke rate and watts/stroke. A recent set was 20 x 2 mins, rest 20 secs, alternate the legs. I like this idea in particular since it loads the core aysmmetrically so forces the core to work on stabilization.
I also do this in warmups now since it switches on the legs more.

Also, handle hangs with the Grok strap or your own tie-off solution.

[PleaseLockIn]

Now, it is more to improve erg performance than getting stronger and bigger, though my squat and deadlift PBs are months old at this point and I am frankly somewhat small

Those lifts are pretty strong! I’m pretty weak in comparison though in my gym I’m one of the stronger guys.

Idk what strength standards there are for rowing other than https://www.researchgate.net/profile/St ... Rowers.pdf but if this is any accurate I ain’t that weak

Preferably those plans suited for long distance low rate?

It's all relative; I was strong but in my gym at the time, I was a pretty average lifter. My lifts have up dropped off but I still maintain about a 500lbs deadlift (looking to keep this lift up or put some more strength back on) and am doing mainly weighted pull-ups and weighted dips as my upper body lifts.

There were and are a lot of really high level rowers who were exceptional without dedicated strength work. To say that you have to do strength work to be good in the boat or on the erg would be false IMO; however, it's more about stacking cards in your favor. That said, I am not them, and most of us are not them. I personally feel as though incorporating strength work helps much more than it hurts. As I get older, it's also important for reasons other than just <insert sport> performance.

I would look into strength programs written by strength coaches that are designed more for athletes or folks who are using strength training as general physical preparedness (GPP) for other activities. At the end of the day, strength training is nothing but general training if it's not the actual focus. This seems to apply to you if you're looking to improve rowing performance as well as any athlete for that matter.

I've always been a big fan of and advocate for the Wendler 5/3/1 program. One issue that some have with it is that it is a very general template or guide with a lot of flexibility so people can get in their own way a bit. With his athletes, he generally has strength work done two to three times per week with one main barbell lift a day and two to three assistance lifts per day such that each session is rather full body. Another program to look into is Tactical Barbell - I personally prefer either the operator template or the fighter template depending on how many times per week you want to do strength work.

Both of these programs do take a more long term approach to training so they tend to be relatively slow and conservative with loading, but that is perfect IMO for those who are using strength training to compliment or supplement other pursuits.

A few mentioned focusing more on strength endurance than strength. I don't think either are wrong per se, I just look at it a bit different. I'll caveat this with the fact that I do and have done a lot of bodyweight (or weight vest) circuits where I do a pretty high volume of pull-ups, push-ups, and walking lunges. These sessions though have become more of a replacement or substitute for when I can't get on an erg and want to train in a manner than puts some stress on the muscular system while elevating the HR and keeping it up for a period of time. I do think that you need to build your top end a bit and not just do higher rep stuff. To me, it's like doing nothing but steady state work. Yes, you can get fit and fast doing nothing but steady state with the occasional test piece, but you will undoubtedly be better if you mix in the sharper, more intense stuff from time to time.

On the low rate piece comment, I think doing a good amount of low rate training does help to reinforce technique and a strong stroke, but don't neglect higher rates for an extended period as they need to be trained and they are a skill that is needed to go fast.

Yes, I agree the most with your post. I’ll do 5/3/1 wendler strength training, twice a week. Do you think it is too little?

I do feel I need to train my top end so sure, I’ll try it. Besides, whatever it takes at this point

And for higher rates, I’m trying it in intervals and in grey zone steady state…

[gvcormac]

I do bodyweight strength exercises for my health rather than specifically to improve rowing (for which I'm cardio not strength limited).

I have a doorway chin-up bar that I use for chin-ups and pull-ups. I have high parallettes that I use for dips. I do step-ups on to a 14" box, carrying 90 lbs of weight (2 dumbbells and a backpack). I do hollow-body holds and abs rollouts (which you can do on the rower, but I generally use a wheel because my rower is back-to-the wall.

You want a chin-up bar like this, because it is higher and more secure than the in-frame ones: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B07X3NTG93

I have Lebert dip bars but their price has increased since tariffs: https://www.amazon.ca/Lebert-Fitness-Eq ... B0781VSY45. I'm sure Canadians and other non-Americans can find a cheaper alternative.

This routine has helped me build a lot of upper body muscle and abs strength. Not sure it does much for my legs, as with stairs and running they aren't a weak link.

I cycle every day and run every other day, in addition to rowing and very occasional skiErging.

[jcross485]

Yes, I agree the most with your post. I’ll do 5/3/1 wendler strength training, twice a week. Do you think it is too little?

I do feel I need to train my top end so sure, I’ll try it. Besides, whatever it takes at this point

And for higher rates, I’m trying it in intervals and in grey zone steady state…

Twice a week might be on the low side if looking to gain considerable strength; I am strength training 2x every 6 days but I am also more in "maintenance" mode than anything. That said, you're better off starting 2x a week for 6-9 weeks, seeing how things are going, and adjusting up from there, rather than starting out with too much and having to pull back.

The higher rates are a skill; if you don't use it, you will lose it so to speak. You can get mighty good, fast, and strong on the erg doing a lot of low rate work, but you'll never maximize your potential if you don't get comfortable with higher rates. It's one of my own weaknesses I am addressing by making sure I get higher rate work done once a week with more mid - moderate rate work done one additional time per week in addition to my lower rate aerobic work.